Getting started with PPC

Episode Description

Discover essential PPC strategies for businesses transitioning from physical stores to online platforms, tips for launching successful PPC campaigns, and expert advice on optimizing PPC accounts for better performance.

Topics discussed:

• Consumers are afraid to visit your brick-and-mortar stores.
• How do you drive buyers to your online store
• Tips for getting started with your first PPC campaign
• When should you use a Smart Campaign vs a regular campaign
• What common issues plague PPC accounts

Episode Takeaways

Consumers Afraid to Visit Brick-and-Mortar Stores: Driving Online Traffic

• Highlighted the shift from physical to online stores due to COVID-19.
• Emphasized the importance of transitioning brick-and-mortar businesses to digital platforms.
• Discussed strategies for capturing online traffic through PPC (Pay-Per-Click) advertising to compensate for decreased foot traffic.

Tips for Starting Your First PPC Campaign

• Introduced the concept of Smart Campaigns for beginners lacking PPC expertise.
• Covered basic strategies for setting up effective PPC campaigns, including choosing the right keywords and optimizing ad copies.
• Stressed the importance of understanding and setting clear conversion goals.

Using Smart Campaigns vs. Regular Campaigns

• Explained Smart Campaigns as an easy entry point for newcomers to PPC, providing basic yet automated campaign management.
• Compared Smart Campaigns to regular PPC campaigns, noting the latter offers more control and customization for experienced users.
• Recommended starting with Smart Campaigns for learning and transitioning to more sophisticated PPC strategies as familiarity increases.

Common Issues in PPC Accounts

• Discussed frequent mistakes such as improper use of keyword match types and neglecting negative keywords.
• Emphasized the significance of continuous optimization and monitoring of PPC accounts to avoid common pitfalls.
• Suggested regular reviews of search terms reports and adjustments to strategies based on performance data.

Episode Transcript

Frederick Vallaeys: Welcome to PPC Town Hall. This is episode 14 and my name is Fred Vallaeys. I’m the CEO at Optmyzr, and I’m your host for PPC Town Hall this week. So for anyone who’s counting, this is episode 14. The last one before that was number 12, but in these times I figured the last thing we need is to use. A number of like 13 to attempt faith with everything that’s going on these days.

So what we’re talking about is, is not specifically COVID related, but I think it’s kind of hard to stay away from that topic in this day and age. So we wanted to talk about new advertisers on PPC, and that’s going to be the topic for today, but there’s kind of two angles to that topic. So the first thing we want to cover is.

If your business has been impacted by covid And you’ve been doing a business through brick and mortar, but all of a sudden you’re forced to go online Now maybe the first time that you’re looking at digital advertising at search marketing and pay per click To get more customers and leads to your business.

So that could be one type of new advertiser And we’re going to be covering some tips about how to get started and the right way to set things up. Now, the other angle could be that you’ve been advertising online for a long time, but you’ve just gotten some Google ad credits or some of the things that you’ve been doing in the past are not quite working the same that they used to in this different day and age.

And so you’re looking to explore new avenues, new channels. So in that regards, you’re not a new advertiser, but you’re new to a specific channel. And so that’s going to be the topic for today So we’ll get started here in a minute and we’ll do the pre roll and then i’ll bring in the guests who we have for today So thanks for joining.

I also want to say do ask questions So the comments are alive on the youtube and the facebook channels. So anything you type in there, we might show it up on the screen So i’d say hello Tell us where you’re coming in from and then also make sure you put in your questions for the panelists Or if you have your own questions Advice for someone please put that in as well And we might show it on the screen and have a little bit of a discussion around that.

So thanks for joining here. We

All right, and our first guest for today is julie bacchini of course the woman behind ppc chat these days So many of you may have interacted with her as neptunemoon. Welcome to the show Julie. Good to have you

Julie Bacchini: Thank you. I feel pretty hype after that. You know, video intro there.

Frederick Vallaeys: I know we know we switch.

It’s nice. Epic music. I like

Julie Bacchini: it. I like it.

Frederick Vallaeys: Hey, so thanks for joining us. And so the other panelists we have today is Susan Wenograd from Aimclear. No stranger to the show. So welcome back.

Susan Wenograd: Hey, thanks for having me back. It’s good to be here.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. So how are things going with both of you? Anything new in in these strange times?

Susan Wenograd: I mean, I’m home a lot. That’s exciting. I guess I’ve baked many things. I mean,

Frederick Vallaeys: other than

Susan Wenograd: that, just pivoting client accounts pretty much.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. So we’ll talk about that. So, but let me introduce both of you a little bit better for for the folks on the show. So. Susan, you work at aimClear. Tell us a bit about aimClear and what you do there.

Susan Wenograd: Yeah, we’re an integrated digital marketing agency. So we kind of do a little bit of everything to get people online and help them succeed online. So I’m the chief marketing officer there. I help oversee strategy for a number of accounts. I speak when there used to be conferences on behalf of aimClear.

And I work with the, the account managers a lot on kind of, you know, keeping up to date, testing things, understanding what’s happening in the marketplace. And how things are working, not working, how new tools are doing. And then I’m also the PPC reporter for Search Engine Journal. So pretty much every day, especially recently. I cover anything to do with platform updates, any kind of paid media news. That’s what the people might want to know about. Yeah,

Frederick Vallaeys: we’ll have lots to talk about from some of those. Yes. And Julie, tell us what you’re doing with Neptune Moon.

Julie Bacchini: Neptune Moon actually turns 21 today. Yay. Happy birthday, Neptune Moon.

Frederick Vallaeys: Absolutely.

Julie Bacchini: Absolutely. My focus, I mean, I, I’ve been in all aspects of the business, but I’ve been focused exclusively on PPC for probably the last 10 years Working with all different kinds of clients on all, you know, across all the different platforms. And of course, in addition to that, I I took over PPC chat a couple of years ago.

And so I’ve been trying to, you know, kind of keep that going and, and, you know, increase its reach and increase its momentum to help support. The paid search community.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay, nice. And you were on the Olympic committee in Atlanta.

Julie Bacchini: I was, I did. I worked for the Olympic committee in Atlanta. Yes. That’s my little fun fact.

And

Frederick Vallaeys: maybe one day we’ll have sports events like Olympics again, hopefully. Maybe,

Julie Bacchini: maybe.

Susan Wenograd: Who knows?

Frederick Vallaeys: All right. So, Hey let’s talk about COVID. And so the first thing I wanted to show here is this is brain labs in conjunction with Optmyzr, a few others. So we’re running surveys and we’re asking the community, what are you seeing in terms of shifting budgets?

How are your clients behaving? So at the start of every month, we ask people to fill that out. So if you do that right there, it’s not for marketing purposes, but it’s basically, you’ll put in your information and then you get the aggregate back out of it. So we’ll have an update on those numbers in about two weeks or so.

But but what have you seen in terms of, you know, are people shifting their dollars between different channels? Are they coming back online, spending?

Susan Wenograd: I think for, you know, for me, it’s been interesting to watch what’s happening in e commerce because for a while it was, you know, Not just the kind of certain things are doing well and then certain things are not doing well.

So like, you know, travel fell off, but then athleisure where became, you know, started to explode because everybody’s sitting at home. But what got interesting was not just the media cost piece, but just also the challenges that came from that, that you know, a lot of agencies I don’t think really thought about because they’re not the actual retailer.

So things would be selling like gangbusters and it’s exciting because obviously you want that to happen, especially during this, this sort of time, but what started to happen was that the retailers couldn’t refill their stock because they were unable to receive shipments from China or production was behind or everything was slowed.

And so. There was this interesting kind of ripple effect that happened in the supply chain that I think I’ve, I’ve worked in house on, on e commerce before. So I was kind of waiting for that to happen. But if you haven’t worked on that side, it’s not something you think of. You just kind of assume we’ll just keep selling because people are buying.

So it was an interesting. Issue to see agencies run into where it’s like there’s all this inventory. There’s all this demand, but they have retailers that can’t fulfill it So that’s pretty much passed now, but that was something I observed for about three weeks It seemed to be a real problem, especially for certain sectors.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. What about you julie? What have you seen? Changing?

Julie Bacchini: Obviously the impact on local businesses has been pretty Pretty severe. You know, and depending on where you are and what the restrictions are that are in place and the nature of your, you know, your business, you know, some, some had to, you know, close down for a period of time that meant pausing advertising while they were, you know, trying to figure out how do we, what do we do, right?

How do we want to keep the lights on? We want to keep our business moving forward. What, what do we do? Is there something that we can offer in With the restrictions that are in place that may be in place for some time that may sort of like loosen and then be tightened again. So it’s been interesting watching businesses sort of try to figure, figure that piece out and then also figure out how to advertise in a way that feels appropriate for where we are.

And imagery is one of the things I’m Susan, I’m sure you found this on the, you know, because you do so much Facebook work, but imagery that’s like. People who are sitting too close together or, you know, like things that people that just give people Ajita now when they see it, you don’t want that in your ad, but like, you didn’t have to think about that before.

So I feel like that’s been a really interesting piece to have to think about as well, is like, is this something that people are going to look at and be like, Oh my God, look how close they are to each other.

Susan Wenograd: I think, you know, it’s funny you say that the other part too, that, and I think this is now passed, but there was about a, it felt like about 10 days or so.

Where people were like, is it okay to stop talking about uncertain times yet? Like when is it okay to stop acting like this is new and start acting like this is just the way things are for the foreseeable future. Because people were like, are people burned out on that messaging? Do they want hopeful messaging is hopeful to pandering knowing that we’re still all kind of stuck at home.

Like it was a really interesting now, I think everybody’s kind of moved on from that. There’s. Way less reference to it than it was, but there was definitely a transition period where it was like, what do we say? You know, it’s kind of like, we’ve already talked about these uncertain times and unprecedented and like, it’s the same stuff that everybody’s been talking about.

And they’re like, so what do we say next? Like, if we don’t talk about that, what do we, what do we talk about?

Frederick Vallaeys: So, but where do we start? Right. I mean, aside from messaging before we can even decide what messaging to put up Julie was talking about some of the small businesses who may be heavily impacted, making that initial move to online.

And Google made some announcements about smart campaigns and smart campaigns, basically what was it called? AdWords express. And then it had another name and always rename stuff, right? So keep a track of what’s what but smart campaigns, it is the simplest campaign type for a small business. For someone who doesn’t have ppc expertise to just get going right so for a lot of people on the call today Probably not a great place to start because you’re not going to have amazing control but not everyone’s a ppc expert and not everyone can afford to hire an agency, right?

So what’s what’s sort of the benefits that you guys are seeing from smart campaigns? Do they do they even have a place in the universe because I know a lot of people really hate them

Susan Wenograd: I don’t run any. I mean i’ve I’ve seen You know, I’ve seen accounts that do. And I think part of the challenge also is that there’s like.

These automatically generated conversions that google just kind of names as being a thing And so I think what’s difficult is if business owners don’t know how to look and see what those are They can log and be like wow I have all these conversions and it could just you know If you look and see what those conversions actually are they may not be very high value So I think that that’s one of the challenges there is the and it’s not that it’s not transparent I mean you can go look and see what they are But to your point fred like they may not even know that they can do that or where to go do that You So it’s often I

Frederick Vallaeys: think, and I haven’t seen this in action.

Right. But now you can go to google dot com, do your search and right there next to your ad, you actually see the numbers don’t even have to log in a two different place.

Susan Wenograd: Oh my gosh, I didn’t know that. I didn’t know that either.

Frederick Vallaeys: I worked at Google, like, the number one question we would always get from advertisers was I bought this keyword, why is my ad not showing on it?

The

Susan Wenograd: number one question we get as managers too, Fred, if it makes you feel any better.

Julie Bacchini: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. So that’s one of the new things. And then here, as you can see on the screen, the other component of it is the the free pins that you get on maps. Julie, have you worked with advertisers like Google, my business and.

Sort of getting their locations on the map and how well is that working?

Julie Bacchini: Yeah, so google my business obviously is very it’s very important especially for Local businesses or even service area businesses, even if you don’t have a physical location where people are coming to you the map is incredibly important and the way you get on the map both in your ads And also organically is is google my business.

So I would say one of the things that you want to make sure that you have in order.

Oh,

Frederick Vallaeys: there goes Julie.

Susan Wenograd: It just wouldn’t be COVID and a screen share if something didn’t freeze or crash.

Julie Bacchini: There she is. Oh, here I am. Thanks Xfinity. I don’t know where I cut out, but I was saying that the, the Google My Business is really, is really important. Because it, it drives organic traffic. It drives you showing up in the map pack organically, but if you want to have a location extension showing on your ads, it is, that is done through, you have to connect your Google My Business lists, verified listing to your Google ads account.

Like there’s no, you used to be able to do it manually and that option doesn’t exist anymore. So The getting your GMB listing like up to date, correct, complete is very, very important. I would say all the way around.

Frederick Vallaeys: Right. So Google my business, definitely go and sign up for that. That doesn’t cost anything.

It doesn’t mean you have to advertise. And then that enables you. To set up the smart campaign where you do get to pay a little bit of money and of course if you were an existing advertiser, you may have even gotten some credits right from covid so that’s on the the basic campaign type Susan, I know you were talking about shopping campaigns and retailers

Susan Wenograd: Yeah

Frederick Vallaeys: and so what’s sort of the first step for them to to even?

Move online. So assuming they’re not doing e commerce, right? But you had a local physical retail store what have you seen as good platforms to just get things going and start selling online for the first time?

Susan Wenograd: Yeah, it’s you know shopping’s always kind of difficult because it involves the feed portion and I think that that scares off a lot of people because it’s it’s more coding and devy feeling than advertising feeling so, you know if if you’re on something You Easy.

And you’re just trying to get up and running. I mean, a lot of what a lot of businesses have done is they’ll set up easily on something like Shopify. And that obviously has a there’s several apps that’ll do it actually, but it will do an automatic export to merchant center for you so that you don’t have to necessarily.

You know, have a developer creating a feed for you and doing all that work. So the easiest way is usually just to do kind of a done for you, you know, storefront that you can set up export automatically to merchant center. If they kind of get comfortable with that you know, I would say it’s definitely worth going through the process of having a local inventory.

Feed as well. So it’s a little bit more work. You have to submit the feed and Google calls you to verify You know that you are who you are and you actually have the inventory you say you have but it gives you a little extra like flag when people search for stuff to show that it’s it’s available locally and that they can Come and pick it up,

Frederick Vallaeys: right and that speaks to your point about availability, right?

So it’s not because you sell it sometimes that you can actually deliver it today And I think we’re gonna jump a little bit here from like the basics of hey you got to set up your Shopping feed and maybe go through shopify and a system that does that for you but let’s also talk about the more advanced right?

So if you’re going deeper on shopping We wrote a great post here about supplemental feeds For people who weren’t scared enough yet about getting technical

Susan Wenograd: Now you get to make more of them

Frederick Vallaeys: Right, but let’s show people the whole power, right? So you start selling online and then you start realizing hey, maybe I want to prioritize X or y or we got special promotions running or we’re low on inventory.

Like how do you? What kind of controls do you have and I think supplemental feeds really speak to that.

Susan Wenograd: Yeah. I really love supplemental feeds. For instances where you know, a lot of times there’ll be retailers or brands. They’ve done a great job creating a brand It feels like a personality the products have quirky names or you know, it’s it’s it’s It’s something that just feels like their brand.

The challenge that you run into is that those, you know, brand titles and sometimes the descriptions are not, you know, kind of for better lack of a better term, kind of SEOed. So it’s like, you know, the, on the Google shopping side, Google’s just looking to see what you’re feeding it. And it’s showing you for searches based on what it thinks that you’re relevant for.

So if you’re missing that text. You know, before, like way back when we didn’t have it, you kind of had to make the decision of like, okay, either we’re going to edit our site text. So if we’re using something like Shopify and we automatically export that product’s information, it’s going to include that stuff.

But when they did supplemental feeds, it was nice because if you are in that situation where it’s like, you’re just using an automatic export, But you know that there’s certain things you want to change. It gives you the opportunity to do that. So you can basically set up logic within Merchant Center that says, yeah, use my regular feed, except this field, I want you to use this.

And it can just refer to a Google sheet. So you can say like, you know, for product, Title, if you want to have, you know, the name, but then add in the keywords that are relevant to it. You can do that without touching anything on your site. So it kind of acts like a translator between the website and Google shopping so that you are, you know, You’re a little more search term rich.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, and I guess it’s a technical concept, but in a way it’s actually a low tech type solution because like you’re saying is Shopify or whatever system you’re using it automatically regenerates your feed. Every day and so rather than trying to like muck with that. Yeah And then 12 hours later it gets overwritten by the automated system Yep This is as simple as setting up a spreadsheet where you have the key to the product and now you actually have a google spreadsheet That you know how to use and you update and it automatically connects like if you say you want to create a supplemental feed It’s like how do you want to do it?

Susan Wenograd: You can click google sheets. It opens it for you. It automatically connects them It’s it’s it’s it’s it’s You know, it feels, like I said, it can feel scary to people that aren’t techie people because I’m not a huge tech person, but I was able to learn how to do them. So you’re basically just kind of giving it if then logic.

So you’re like, you know, use everything, but, you know, if we’re pulling in the product column or the product title, I want you to refer to this instead. So it just overrides that feature. So it gives you a way to, You know take something that might be a little overly branded. You know based on the website experience and make it a little more search friendly.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, I like that So definitely check that out for folks who haven’t already. Julie, what have you seen on on ppc chat? Let’s let’s load up the ppc chat website here. Well, it’s not the website. It’s twitter, right? But I know you talk we have recaps

Julie Bacchini: we have recaps on the you know on the site So if you’re not able to see the chats or if you want to catch up on topics that we’ve talked about we do have You Recaps that are on the website.

There we go.

Frederick Vallaeys: There it is. And then where’s the recap here so my screen is

Julie Bacchini: a

Frederick Vallaeys: little small each

Julie Bacchini: each post each post is the Each post of those posts is a recap of one of the the chats.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay, then you got the recap here on karuya Okay. So yeah, for folks who haven’t checked out PPC chat, it is really useful.

It’s a great place to learn and talk to the community. But Julie comes up at five or six questions every week, every Tuesday at what is it? 9 a. m. 9 a. m. Pacific, right?

Julie Bacchini: Yep. Noon Eastern. Same

Frederick Vallaeys: time as this, but on Tuesdays. And then anyone gets to answer what they think and have a conversation. So what have you heard about?

Smart campaigns or shopping and people moving online recently.

Julie Bacchini: I mean, I think a lot of what you guys have already covered, but just talking about how to How to find that space how to find, you know, it’s Some things that are tried and true are still working great but other things that it’s like, wow, you know, if the bottom and it’s very specific, I would say not even just to industry or type of business, but it also has a lot to do with where, with where you are geographically and sort of what’s happening in your micro community and the communities that you serve.

So, you know, you could be having very different experiences, even, you know, if you operate in three different states, what’s working in Pennsylvania, for example, you know, the same thing might not be happening in New Jersey or, you know, New York. So I think being more flexible in what you’re doing and looking for small and incremental things that maybe seem to be taking hold.

And then trying to say like, okay, is there something really here, right? Is there, is there something here that I should be paying attention to and something that I can build upon or how can I experiment to see if I put a little bit more behind, you know, X, Y, or Z, is that going to make us, you know, any kind of substantive difference?

I think there’s a lot of discussion going on around those, you know, those types of topics by industry and sort of, you know, generally as well.

Frederick Vallaeys: And Julie, before you and I were talking before we came live here, But about people may be shifting to different channels altogether, like Facebook yes, talk about that.

Julie Bacchini: Sure. So I think it’s, and it’s kind of a weird, I want to preface this by saying it’s a bit of a weird time to be talking about Facebook advertising with the whole, you know, boycott Facebook movement that’s gaining, you know, gaining momentum. So I’m definitely aware of that. And I, I, It’s hard. Sometimes as marketers, we sort of are of two minds about things, right?

Like we have a particular way of thinking and feeling about something when it comes to doing our jobs and getting results for clients. And then we have another way of thinking about things of like, well, this is how I feel about this personally. It’s a little conflicted at the moment, but if we’re just going to talk strictly about things that you can do that will help you to potentially Reach existing customers or previous customers.

I feel like Facebook’s biggest advantage in advertising is if you have any kind of customer list and you are able to upload that into Facebook, this is a great time to be able to reach out to your, your previous customers, people who bought from you previously and let them know, Hey, we’re still here and here’s what we’re doing now.

This is what we’re offering. This is how you can still, you know, buy from us. And then of course, taking advantage of all of the data. Excuse me, that they collect and using the lookalike audience feature can also help you if you’re trying to expand of like, all right, well, our regular people aren’t buying as much as we want.

Maybe we need to kind of expand a little bit and see if there are others, you know, who, who might in this, in this time.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And so here’s a post that I did on search engine journal don’t not under quite as frequently as Susan but it’s a three ways to spend your Google ad credits. One of the points is try a new channel now.

Obviously you can’t take your google money to go spend on facebook But it’s sort of the same principle and sort of the way that I structured it was first of all you want to maximize your results In the places where you already have the most success, right? So prioritize campaigns driving the lowest cost per acquisition Do more of that.

Then secondarily, try some new things. So that could be trying new match types that you maybe haven’t tried before. Maybe try new ad formats like responsive search ads, if you’ve been hesitant to do those. And then in third place, try something entirely new. So, and then we’re talking about going to YouTube ads, do Facebook ads, try dynamic search ads, right?

But so kind of an order of priority, that’s how I would put it. Agree, disagree, different advice on. What to do with if you’re kind of going to explore new things?

Susan Wenograd: No, I think those are all pretty valid. I mean, I, you know, I think the other thing too is some businesses are in situations as well, where if there’s increased competition, some of those costs are getting higher.

So it’s also. The ads credit piece. And then also, is there a point at which you’re just seeing, you know, reverse ROI on just dumping more and more into search ads? So what

Frederick Vallaeys: do you mean by reverse ROI?

Susan Wenograd: Well, kind of, you know, at a certain point it’s like you’re, you dump more and more in and you just aren’t, you stop getting the return that you were getting.

So it’s like, you’re getting more and more click volume, but it might not necessarily be driving. Sales at that point and or combined with higher CPCs because of increased competition because there were so many more businesses that have to sell online now. So, you know, if the cost thing is a factor, if you’ve scaled kind of as high as you can and, or you’ve scaled to a point where you’re just not seeing the ROI that you need to, to justify those are great places to diversify for sure.

Frederick Vallaeys: And here’s where it gets mathematical, but there’s this whole fascinating concept of like averages and average CPA and average CPC. And I think Susan, what you’re talking about a bit too, is like the incremental cost to achieve the next set of results. It could be that, you know, you’re averaging position two with your ads and you’re getting great results and now you buy yourself into position one.

And on average, you’re still remaining. Under the target that you’ve said. But actually, if you looked at that new segment of traffic that you bought incrementally would have been above your cost.

Susan Wenograd: Yeah, it’s less profitable.

Frederick Vallaeys: Exactly. And so, and that’s the big mistake people make, right? And I think if you’re coming online for the first time, you’re going to be introduced to concepts like target CPA, target ROAS right.

But is that a business metric that you traditionally talked about? Well, probably not so much, right. You talked about profits and revenue. So I, and I think that’s a really smart point, Susan, is you got to look at What is your return on investment and your overall profit going to be by setting different levels?

Because you don’t just want to take those metrics that the engines give you and trust them 100 percent because they can be misleading in some cases.

Julie Bacchini: Yeah, just a bit. I think the DSA piece is interesting too for a couple of reasons. One is if you’re new to this and you haven’t really been advertising in, in search and you’re kind of not sure what terms you want to advertise on DSA can be really interesting to kind of reveal.

It’s, I think it’s interesting on a number of fronts. It lets you know what Google thinks of you, which I think is always valuable information to have.

Frederick Vallaeys: How do you know what Google thinks about you in that regards?

Julie Bacchini: I think just because you’re when you run the DSA, it’s it’s deciding more so than when you run regular ads, right?

Because when you run regular ads, you’re saying, well, these are the keywords that I want. And then this is what I you know, these are my ads. And this is my landing page. When you do the DSA is you’re still writing the majority of the ad copy. But it’s just like Google’s deciding, well, when should we show your ad based on how they’ve crawled the pages or your site, you know, whatever you’ve asked them to do.

And then they have an idea of what they think you should match for. And it’s a bit of a window into, you know, what, what do they think you’re relevant for?

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, it’s a bit of a window into SEO, right? And so DSA, dynamic search ads. And like you were explaining, Julia, for the listeners who might not be quite as familiar, but, Yeah.

Rather than controlling everything, you just tell Google what your website is. And then they figure out, well, we would have organically shown you for these keywords because they seem relevant. And then they pull out some of the, the title tags from your pages and they use that to generate the ad.

So all you control as the advertiser is what section of my site should Google consider and what is my description? And, and then basically they, they go and run with it.

Julie Bacchini: But I like to use that as a start, like as a starting point. I’m not advocating that you look like just run DSA, but I think if you’re getting started and you’re not quite sure of like you have the obvious keywords that you want to advertise on, but then if you’re like, well, I’m not really sure what else to do.

I think if you run DSA for a little while, it can give you some, some insight into, Oh, like this might actually be a good thing for us to build an actual campaign around you know, more deliberately.

Frederick Vallaeys: So if you come into advertising for the first time, And you have no interest in learning it, use a smart campaign.

If you’re like, I really want to do this, right. But I don’t know where to start use the dynamic search ads campaign, because it’s going to give you more of a foundation. And an insight. And then actually, it allows you to tweak more stuff down the line as well. Like seeds.

Julie Bacchini: It’s like you’re finding seeds that you can plant, you know, yourself and then, and then create, you know, if you’re not, if you’re not sure what to, you know, what to do, it can be an interesting place to start.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, I like that. All right. So let’s take a look at an article that Susan has written on search engine journal. And Susan, there were sort of two articles that you did recently. To the top here. But one of them was like about mistakes and the other so this is about mistakes and the other one was sort of the flip side of that, like the eight things that will make you more money.

So why don’t we talk about mistakes first since

Susan Wenograd: yeah, so I, I kind of boiled it down to the biggest things that I’ve seen over and over through the years. And interestingly, they’re not limited to like, okay. New advertisers. There’s plenty of, you know, campaigns that I’ve audited or taken over from people that have supposedly managed PPC for a while, and there’s just shocking amounts of things that aren’t paid attention to

Frederick Vallaeys: problem, right?

So supposedly manage it means

Susan Wenograd: it’s a it’s a loose interpretation of management, but you know, like one of the ones and I think this is also really confusing for for new folks, too, to be fair, is Is I think the first thing I had on there was match types. And so, so many people that set it up, they, you know, they type in the keywords they want, which makes total sense, but they’re, they don’t understand how Google interprets that, you know, input.

So things like broad match there, you know, a lot of times. Folks don’t know that you can even look at the search queries you’re getting matched for to figure out if they’re relevant or not. So, you know, those instances where it’s kind of leaving a whole lot up to Google that’s usually where, you know, and it’s not monitored in any way.

We usually see a lot of issues around that. And so, you know, there’s, there’s things like that. There’s, Also things like you know, they, they have really interesting demographic data that you can add as an observation and then bid up or down on those audiences. I see a shocking amount of accounts that still don’t use that.

When they’re allowed, I mean, some of them, let’s explain that for a second, right? So so you started with keywords and then you went into like bid adjustments and audiences. And so there’s sort of two different types of bid adjustments. One of them would be something like geographic. Or your ad by nature has shown in different locations, say in the United States.

Frederick Vallaeys: So Google can give you data immediately the moment you ask about how has your ad performed in San Francisco versus New York, even though you didn’t specifically put San Francisco and New York as targets. You just put the United States as the overarching target. And then what you’re talking about is like these no, the term is audience

Susan Wenograd: observation,

Frederick Vallaeys: observation.

So with audiences, it’s different because Google doesn’t know who your audiences are until you specify those audiences. And then you have to say, I’m not ready to make bit adjustments, but I want to observe how these different audiences are performing. So there was just for how many weeks do you actually give it to kind of build up that data before you then switch from observing to using it to manage.

Susan Wenograd: It, it really depends on the data sample size. You know, for some of them it’s, you might find that it’s like the majority of your audience. So it’s like, if you sell, you know, appliances or something and you put an in market for appliances or, you know, home and garden, you know, You might get data pretty quickly because you may find that’s the majority of who’s searching your stuff anyway.

So sometimes it’s a couple of weeks, sometimes it’s one week. Like it just, it kind of depends. I tend to add a lot of audience layers for observation. And then I make bit adjustments once the sample sizes

Frederick Vallaeys: are, you know, you add in a lot of those layers. Like how many are we talking here? I

Susan Wenograd: mean, no, no,

Frederick Vallaeys: no,

Susan Wenograd: no.

Usually probably like 10 to 15. Sometimes less depending on, you know, kind of how much, how many categories there are that Google will let me do. But a lot of times that we, when I go into accounts, I find that people only use it for remarketing. So the only audiences they have in there for observation are their own remarketing audiences, like people that have visited the site and that’s fine.

I mean, it’s a best practice. But they’re missing out on all of this other kind of top of funnel persona information. That could be helpful to them as well

Frederick Vallaeys: And so the remarketing obviously is very powerful because it gives you great cpas But it’s like well that makes sense because you’ve already paid for those people to come to you Even if it’s through seo you’ve invested money in the website in the blog, right?

So Those numbers look great, but they’re not as great as Google might make you believe,

Susan Wenograd: right?

Frederick Vallaeys: Smart shopping campaign, right? So we talked about smart campaigns, which is for the local advertiser, but you got smart shopping campaigns where you know, once you have that data feed, Google will sort of figure out when to show your product ads and but it includes remarketing and includes the display network.

It includes YouTube, and then you get this generic number at the end. And for a lot of advertisers, it looks better than Google. Manually managed shopping campaigns, but it’s because remarketing is in that mix, right? And by nature, that’s just more efficient

Susan Wenograd: Yep,

Frederick Vallaeys: and google doesn’t break it up And then I love your point about the in market audiences, right?

So if you haven’t done a lot of online advertising before, Google’s actually gotten really advanced so they can tell you like these people were shopping for the thing that you sell. And, and it’s as specific, like if you’re a car dealer, like Google will tell you these people were looking for a BMW.

Susan Wenograd: Yeah, makes and models.

It’s crazy.

Frederick Vallaeys: Exactly. So obviously, and so my question here is, you can go really deep, right? So you can say these people remarketing, they’ve already expressed interest or they’re in market based on some other signals that Google has. Obviously you want to put your money there first because it’s going to result or it’s going to lead to quick results.

To what degree are you killing your upper funnel? And like, how do you want to measure and make sure that you’re not over investing at that final stage and maybe kind of hurting yourself down the line?

Susan Wenograd: I mean, a lot of times I tend to set up. The remarketing pieces as separate campaigns where I’m just targeting those people.

And I keep them separate from, you know, where I might have those kind of more top of funnel audiences. And it also lets me do different messaging cause I know that they already know my brand. Cause like a lot of times, you know, they’ve been to the site already. So the stuff I’m going to talk to them about is probably different than what I’m going to say to someone that’s just searching or is obviously looking for phrases that.

You know, they’re, they’re in research and comparison mode as opposed to someone who’s already been to the site and is familiar with our offerings. So I tend to approach search for more of that perspective where it’s kind of like, I think about buyer stages and when, you know, especially when there’s certain phrases that indicate that like they are way top of funnel, they’re just now researching, or they’re at the point where they’re researching us versus a competitor.

All those people are at different places in the buying cycle. So and especially those that know your brand versus don’t, that’s when I feel like you probably have the best opportunity to separate those and give them separate messaging as well.

Frederick Vallaeys: And Julie, how do you go about like with newer clients, setting up the right measurement systems and attribution models?

Julie Bacchini: First I want to say, I agree with everything Susan just said. Like I would have said it the exact same way. So I think that keeping it simple. Like sometimes you can drown in data and or you can have data that feels like it’s telling you stuff, but it’s not really. So I think having clarity over believe it or not, the what’s the conversion action that you’re looking for?

Like, it’s amazing to me how many. Businesses I talked to. I mean, if you’re e commerce, it’s pretty clear what your conversion action is, right? You want people to buy stuff. But if you’re not a calm sometimes getting the definition of that conversion action like that’s such an important first step. It is the lens through which you look at everything else.

So if this is what you’re trying to get people to do, or if you have different things that you’re trying to get people at different stages to do, you need a lot of clarity on that. So that you can set things up in such a way that that data is coming back to you and then you can Have your remarketing plan in place for like, okay if they got this far This is I want to set up this audience and then I want to be pushing this next aspect which we have found over time Take somebody from that like, oh, we’re at the stage where we’re googling for you know, xyz company reviews, right?

So, you know, they’re probably doing that for a number of different items, you know, and just being smart about What are you trying to get them to do? And having that clarity, I feel it goes so far in helping you to set things up in a smart way. And if you go to an even more basic level, maybe so, you kind of know what you want people to do, but like, is it picking up the phone?

Frederick Vallaeys: And like, did you put phone call tracking in place? Do you put lead forms in place? Like what systems tend to work well for that? I think all those things are important, especially if you’re a local business, the, the it’s worth investing in call tracking software in, in my opinion, I mean, Google offers it.

Julie Bacchini: So if you don’t have the budget to use a third party call tracking, Google does. But I think that the data that you get back if, if phone, if you are optimizing for phone calls and you like, that’s your preferred, you know, it’s like we, we want people to pick up the phone and call or want them to physically come to us.

And we weight those things equally, then you need to do more. You need to do more tracking and having tracking numbers to know where those calls are coming from, being able to grade the quality of, you know, what’s coming in and all that. It’s, It’s important because you can look at your top line numbers.

You can look at stuff just in Google ads, for example, and feel like you’re killing it. And then, you know, you talk to the client, you’re like, dang, we said so many, you know, we had so many calls and we sent so much volume and you’re feeling really great about yourself. Right. And then you talk to the client and they’re like, yeah we didn’t get that many calls or all of the calls we got, or most of the calls we got were people who, you know, were interested in our competitor or, you know, so we All of that information is really, really important to them.

Kind of put back in, you know, to what you’re doing to make it, make it better and make it more targeted for what you really, really want to have happen. Exactly.

Frederick Vallaeys: And then also keep in mind if you’re newer to this, right? Like PPC is not your silver bullet. That’s going to solve all your problems. So yeah, it makes, it makes the phone ring, but if you haven’t trained your staff on expecting these calls from people who did an online search and they are not trained at least in some sales capacity, like you’re going to be wasting those calls.

So make sure your whole team knows that, okay, these are the keywords we bought. This is the offer we put in the ad. So people might be asking about this. So help them and don’t assume like most people who call the local business, they’ve probably gone through that local business. And now you get all of these new people who haven’t been, who don’t know anything about you.

And if your salesperson treats them the exact same way, then yeah, obviously they’re going to fall through the cracks. They are not going to close that deal. All right. So let’s shift on to another article here, or is there anything else, Susan, from from this one that you think is.

Susan Wenograd: No, I mean, the only thing that I, you know, I mentioned in that article that I think kind of ties into, in a way to what Julie and I were talking about with like personas and where people are in their buying stage is.

The other thing I see brands try and do a lot is like insert themselves into a search. Like if someone’s searching something loosely related to what they do, they’re like, well, I need to show up because if they’re searching for that, surely they’re going to care about this other thing. And I have to explain often that like searchers are very single minded.

It’s like when they go in and they take, tell Google, this is what I want. That is all they are looking for. So trying to kind of like insert. And I think that in the the example I wrote is like if someone searched for Nike running shoes. Surely there’s a brand out there that’s like, well, I sell sports bras.

So I need to show up when someone searches for that. It’s not going to work well. Like they’re looking, they have told Google gods, like I am looking for shoes. Anything that is not a Nike sneaker at that point is not going to get the attention. So, and it’s, you know, it’s, it’s a valid want. I mean, that’s how marketing works, but search marketing is just a little different that way.

So, you know, I always caution brands don’t get too cute or creative with that.

Frederick Vallaeys: Exactly. That’s where you have the audiences now, right? And I think advertisers were trying to do it is because audiences didn’t exist for the longest time in Google ads. But now that they do, it’s like, okay, your user told you they’re looking for sneakers now or more generically, they’re looking for shoes.

But if you demographically know that they’re interested in sportswear or athleisure, you can show them the sneaker versus, you know, the heels.

Susan Wenograd: Yep.

Frederick Vallaeys: And so, and that’s where you got to layer stuff, right?

Susan Wenograd: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: That’s so cool. I mean, so if you get into online advertising, like you start with these basic layers, like give us an out text, give us a keyword and you’re off to the races, but now you get to do all these cool things like bid adjustments and layering audience.

Susan Wenograd: It made my inner marketer so happy. Cause that was always my one thing with, with paid searches for a long time. I was like, it’s, it had very limiting marketing capability and it was very hard because. You know, for those of us that do a lot of like full funnel, all stage marketing, we’re just like, gosh, if only we had that data, right.

We were always like, Google must have this data. Like, but why we can’t see, like, you’d go in to look at demographics and it’s like 81%, the gender is unknown. Like it didn’t, it just didn’t happen. You go into like ages, like, you know, 80 percent of them, it’s like an unknown age. And you’re like, why? What is this?

Like this is not helpful. So it was nice when they finally started integrating those audiences that they had elsewhere into the search side, because it does give you a lot of insight into who these people are and how they might search differently. Like you’ll see a lot of keywords that, you know, there might be one audience that just kills it on, on this one set of words and they never show up in another one.

So it gives you a lot of insight into the words they use, how they talk about things, how they think about things.

Frederick Vallaeys: All right, so the the flip side of that article about the things you can do wrong. This is the one eight winning strategies so let’s see some what’s your number one point make your landing page relevant

Susan Wenograd: I don’t care how many optimizations you do if your landing page sucks.

You’re not gonna get Any sales. And I think that’s, I think Julie would agree. It’s one of the hardest parts you run into is because we generally don’t control the landing pages. So I know Julie feels my pain. Cause she’s nodding. Yeah, there’s,

Frederick Vallaeys: there’s an ad on the screen right now for insta page.

Susan Wenograd: Contextual placement. Google,

Frederick Vallaeys: how often do you actually like the main control from the client? And you say, listen, we understand we can’t touch your main website, but just like with a supplemental feed, like we got to have. Supplemental landing page that we can actually connect the dots. So we sometimes we call that like preserving the sense of the query.

So. Whatever the user typed in as the keyword, that is what they were looking for. So make sure that that term or keyword appears in the ad because the user immediately clicks, right? And we’re like, that’s stupid, but it’s neurological science. User sees that word, they instantly connect to it. And they’re like, that’s what I was looking for.

They click on it. And the same thing happens. They don’t want to be taken to your like homepage. They want to be taken to a landing page. That’s really about that thing that they’ve just told you they needed help with.

Julie Bacchini: Yep.

Frederick Vallaeys: They went through,

Julie Bacchini: I call it a through line. So they want a really clear through line from the thought they had in their head.

That made them be like, I got to look for that. Right. And then their look, they, they type in or speak something very specific into the search engine and then results come back. And then they already have a bit of a preconceived idea in their head of what they think that they should be seeing. And if your ad matches up with that notion, And then they’re going to click on it.

You want to have a very strong through line from that initial idea to the query that they put in, to what they saw in the ad, to what they ultimately find on the landing page, because if it breaks down at any of those points, you know, prior to the landing page, you probably won’t get the click if you’ve done well enough.

To have your ad say like, yeah, that sounds like what I want. And they click on it and then they get to your page and they’re either confused or it doesn’t seem like it’s directly relevant to what it was that they, you know, that they were searching for. You’re running a huge risk of having a decent percentage of people be like, Nope.

Yeah, and then they’re gonna go back and they’re gonna look for the next thing. So that piece is really really really really important

Frederick Vallaeys: All right. So anything else from this article here? Otherwise, we’ll shift on to a couple of quick hits on the news

Susan Wenograd: Just please use negative keywords

Frederick Vallaeys: What is the negative keywords?

Susan Wenograd: So You know, I mean it it kind of goes back to the match type thing. But you know You know, more and more like I, I tend to, I hardly ever use phrase match at this point.

I pretty much just rely on modified broad cause it tends to be cheaper and convert just as well, if not sometimes better. But the one thing you do have to look at is. There can be nuances where it’s like, I think the example I just saw that I used in the article was like, you know, student apartments versus like family apartments.

So you might be an apartment complex, but do you cater to students? Is it student only? Because if so, you’ve got a whole bunch of negative keywords you’re probably going to want to add in. To make sure that you’re not showing for any of that stuff. And you know, I find a lot of places wait and do that once they start running and they see what they’re matched for.

But a lot of times what I’ll do is when I do the keyword research for a an account, I will take note of what the keyword planner tells me because I find tons of negative keywords just from the keyword research itself. I’m like, Whoa, definitely don’t want to show for that stuff. So using the keyword planner can actually help you find.

What you don’t want to show up for as much as what you do. And I, you know, I, people really focus on the stuff they want to show up for and forget that there’s like this whole other universe out there of ways you’re going to get matched that you’re probably not even thinking about.

Frederick Vallaeys: Right. So use the keyword planner to plan your campaign, put in some preventative negative keywords before you even show up on those.

But then once the account is running, obviously make sure you’re using. A tool shameless plug like Optmyzr or just look at your search terms reports and figure out what negative keywords you should add along the way. And this is interesting too, right? Because. Search is very dynamic. Google changes how they match to certain keywords.

Users change and they evolve how they do searches, right? So you can just set up your campaign and assume that it’s going to be fine forever. It does need active management. And shameless plug for the two of you, right? So an agency can certainly help and take care of some of those details to keep.

Results. Great. And there’s external changes to Fred, like, you know, that you make a good point. There’s things that happen. Like I, way back in the day, I think it was like, Oh, nine or something. I was running PPC for a jeweler and they sold black pearls and pirates of the Caribbean and the curse of the black pearl came out.

Susan Wenograd: And so it’s like it was something, you know, it’s like some external thing that has nothing to do with their industry And then all of a sudden in the search terms were like, oh I forgot there’s a movie with that name So it’s like there’s things that also change that have zero to do with your industry that can start impacting how you show up as well But let me ask you the question.

Frederick Vallaeys: Some clients will then say well But they saw my ad and they clicked on it.

Susan Wenograd: No, you paid for that. And they didn’t buy anything. The answer is it’s bad. I mean, and you may have planted a seed with them. Right. So, but, but don’t, it’s just, it’s not the right place for it. All right. So let’s shift over here to the news. So we’ll run this.

Frederick Vallaeys: All right. How did you like that? Julie, I feel

Susan Wenograd: like I should be out of my seat. I know I’m like in New York City at a news desk when I hear that music.

Frederick Vallaeys: All right. So We’ll bring this in. So a couple of new stories from this week. So the first one, we’ve kind of covered them, but let’s quickly go over them again.

So Google gives businesses free ads and Google maps. Right. So what Google is talking about here is with the smart campaigns, they will give you some pins to drive business to your locations where people are searching those things on maps. And feel free to chime in at any point if you have thoughts on any of these. This one’s quite interesting. More like actual news, not just like features from the engines, but there’s a study out there that says that the usage of voice has plateaued for now. Right. So, and the question was, how do you ask questions on your phone? Like, do you type them in, do you use voice? And that seems to have plateaued.

Susan Wenograd: I kind of wonder how much of that’s because of COVID though, like people aren’t on the, on the go as much. They’re at home more where it’s like, I think a lot of voice searches, like people were in the car, you know what I mean? Or they’re, you know, they’re walking the city streets. So I kind of wonder how much of that is because.

It’s, you know, human habits have changed.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And then there’s the digital assistance in the home, of course. Yeah, I mean, I guess we’re waiting for the next wave of devices to be released for the holiday shopping season. I’ve got like 17 in my house and he go, think of them like constantly chiming in on my conversations.

Susan Wenograd: every once in a while Alexa is like, sorry, I don’t know that we’re like,

Julie Bacchini: aren’t talking to you. You like .

Frederick Vallaeys: But, but the, the other angle here, I mean, so. I think we’ve all been waiting for like, how are we going to advertise on these voice searches? Obviously if that’s slowing down and there may be less incentive for the engines to figure that out and I think there’s sort of two angles here, right?

So one is i’m using my voice to put a search on my phone phone, but the results that I see are still the same that I always get. So I still see the text ads and whatever formats Google is running now. So that, that’s pretty well understood. The other one that’s a little bit more nascent is I asked my voice assistant about something like, how do you insert advertising?

I know Google was doing some efforts there with their marketplaces. I don’t know if any of you have experimented with that, but I haven’t seen a lot of growth on that. And my favorite example is actually Hey digital voice assistant, whose name I shall not say toilet paper. And currently the response is We don’t have any toilet paper.

Good luck with that.

Susan Wenograd: Let’s say to that, or it’s you and everyone else.

Frederick Vallaeys: Exactly. Right. All right. And so the other one that we kind of talked about as well, but the the Facebook boycott so maybe Susan, from your perspective at aim clear you guys have some of the bigger clients, like, are you seeing any of this move away from Facebook and if so, where are they shifting?

Susan Wenograd: Shameless plug. I do have a search engine journal article that covers. The boycott. And I, I, I’m not sure about the, the one you were just showing. I, I kind of pulled together all the details because I was finding a lot of people are like, why is this even happening? Like, what started it? You know what I mean?

There was, there was a little confusion around kind of how that even began. So we haven’t run into it. I mean, you know, for us, this starts getting into that area where this is really more of a pr. Decision and business decision than it is a media one. So, you know, it’s something where we don’t really weigh in on that unless that’s part of what we do for our clients.

What has been interesting is we keep getting a lot of questions of like, does this mean that my media will be cheaper? And you know I mean, it looks like it’s a lot of money to the average person, but when you look at the total piece of the pie that it makes up, it’s not a ton. And you know, a lot of these advertisers that are pulling out, they’re running like reach campaigns.

They’re running brand awareness stuff because, because they’re CPG, they’re not like direct to consumer retailers, that kind of thing. So my assumption is that the impact Advertisers from a cost perspective is probably going to be pretty low because these are probably not the brands that you’re competing with a whole lot.

And especially if you’re running, you know, conversion focused campaigns that’s not what they’re doing. So you’re kind of playing in two different pools with two different kinds of costs. So unless you’re like a direct competitor of these folks, I don’t think you’re going to see much change. I do think that there will probably be more of them.

It’s definitely, you know, picking up steam. You know, there’s been also kind of some flapping because it’s like, Hey, some of these guys weren’t even really spending on these platforms. So they’re just kind of saying that we’re not spending on it as like a PR move, but they weren’t really spending to begin with.

So some of it’s, you know, it’s, it’s more of a PR move than it is a media one.

Frederick Vallaeys: Interesting. And then I didn’t load up the article here, unfortunately, but the other news from Google was more free shopping ads. So as they announced about a month, month and a half ago, they were going to start including data from the Google merchant feed on the shopping tab for free.

So before that, it used to be exclusively paid ads. Now there’s also a section for free ads. Once

Susan Wenograd: upon a time, it was free. Free though. So I feel like we’ve gotten, like, we started going circle circle. Yeah. I’m like, this is so they’ve run out of ideas. Like, you know what, let’s just start doing the free thing again.

No one will remember. And we’ll look amazing.

Frederick Vallaeys: It’s like, this is what you guys did forever. Page was free and completely paid. And that was like half free and half paid. Yep. You’re right. You’re right. But the timing certainly was good. And at least for the optics, I think from Google’s perspective this is going to help some advertisers, but, but ultimately, I mean, listen, More people are going to put their merchant feed into Google, or they’re going to figure out how to do a merchant feed.

And then eventually they’re going to see that, Hey, yeah, people do use Google to shop for stuff. Maybe we should actually start paying for this and we’ll still make more profit. But what they’ve just announced is now they’re also going to start including some free listings in the knowledge panels. So these would show up on the Google search page.

So not the, not the shopping tab, but just the actual Google search results pages. Initially just on mobile. Only in the United States but they’ve said they want to expand it to other places as well. And the good news is if you’ve already opted into including your your ads or your listings, your shopping listings across all Google surfaces, this is automatically part of that.

So you don’t have to do anything extra. It’s just more volume. And we’ll have a session in a couple of weeks where we’ll talk more about shopping again and e commerce. And we’ll certainly take a look at those numbers from how that’s performing.

Julie Bacchini: That’s an interesting, that’s an interesting move.

The knowledge panel is The free listings and the knowledge panel is really interesting. I’ll be curious to see how that, you know, how that plays out.

Frederick Vallaeys: Well, why, why, why do you think it’s an interest? It

Julie Bacchini: seems to me if you were like, that’s a pretty prime real estate. So it’s interesting to me that you would say, Oh, we’re going to have, you know, some free, like free shopping listings, you know, that might be able to appear in there versus your paid.

Shopping. Advertisers. I think it’s

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, I’ve seen from one of the research companies that they’re predicting a 5 percent decline year over year and Google ad spend, which would be a huge first, right? And I don’t know. Maybe this is speaking to some deceleration. Yeah, more to come on that for sure.

All right. So that was the news. You’ve been amazing panelists. I do like to give each of you a chance to plug something that you’re working on, cover any topics that you feel like we’ve missed that are important this week. So who volunteers to go first?

Susan Wenograd: Go ahead, Julie.

Julie Bacchini: Thanks. I volunteer Julie.

Thank you so much. One of the things I wanted to talk, I mean, obviously this is a really interesting time, which is sort of in life, right? And so we’re all trying to figure out how to manage our own lives, our own businesses, how to help our clients, how to You know, we’re just figuring a lot of stuff out.

There’s been a lot to, to, to take in, in the, in the last three, three or four months, but one of the things that I’m working on right now that I’m really excited about that I hope we’ll be rolling out in the next few weeks is I’m working with a few people from the PPC chat community. We’re working on a mentoring program.

It seems like it’s something I’ve been thinking about for a long time and. Really seems like a good time to, to get it off the ground. So working on the infrastructure, the backend and all that piece, but stay tuned in the coming weeks for announcements. It’ll both be, it’ll be located on the PPC chat site, but I will promote the heck of it, heck out of it on, on Twitter.

And the idea is to really try to create some space and create some opportunities for people who just. Need a leg up or need to, you know, have access to seasoned professionals who can help them to advance in their careers.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And I don’t know how much of this is related to the Black Lives Matter movement, but for everyone points.

So congratulations to both of you. You were on the top 25 most influential PPC list. And women were fairly well represented. And we’ll actually have an episode in two weeks with the the two leading ladies of PPC, according to that list. So stay tuned for that one. But people of color were sort of missing on that list.

Right. And so and we’ve had a couple of guests on of color, but certainly sometimes they don’t have the opportunity. So I think that’s what you’re speaking to is that folks like us who have had a chance in this industry need to help out. People who maybe haven’t had the same opportunities along the way, the same support.

So this is a great effort. And yeah, it matters.

Julie Bacchini: Access matters. So we’re, we’re going to try to, you know, get, have more people be able to have that kind of access is the goal.

Frederick Vallaeys: Great. I love it. All right. Now I volunteer Susan to go now.

Susan Wenograd: If you want to visit the aimclear blog aimclear. com forward slash blog.

We’ve got all kinds of stuff coming out on there. My. The post that you should on supplemental feeds just posted this week. So that’s still up there. Michelle Robbins, my wickedly smart coworker is writing a series on B2B marketing. So that started today. So you don’t want to miss that. And then obviously search engine journal.

I’m over there with all the news. Anytime. If you have a hot tip, feel free to email me Susan at search engine journal. com. And I am happy to cover it.

Frederick Vallaeys: All right. Very good. Thank you both very much. So thanks everyone for watching. We will be posting this episode up later today as a podcast. It’ll be available on YouTube.

Ask questions for next week. We’ve got a couple of great future sessions planned. But Susan, Julie, thanks for being here. We look forward to having you again. We’ll see you next time.

Susan Wenograd: Great. Thanks for having me. Thanks a lot.