Here’s Why You Should Use Offline Conversion Imports

Episode Description

Sometimes, an ad doesn’t lead directly to an online sale but instead starts a customer down a path that ultimately leads to a sale in the offline world, such as at your brick-and-mortar store or over the phone. By importing offline conversions, you can measure what happens in the offline world after your ad results in a click or call to your business.

In this video, you’ll hear from Jon Diorio, a former Product Manager at Google who was one of the creators of Offline Conversion Imports. Jon talks to Fred about all things OCI including:

• Why most advertisers don’t use OCI
• Tips on setting up OCI properly
• Enhanced conversions for leads

Episode Takeaways

1. Importance of Offline Conversion Tracking:

• Distinguishing high-quality leads from low-quality ones is essential, especially with automated PPC.
• Offline conversion tracking enables advertisers to provide Google Ads with more accurate data, improving ad performance.

2. Enhanced Conversions for Leads:

• Simplifies the integration process by using customer email addresses instead of requiring GCLID tracking through the CRM.
• Enhances privacy and compliance by hashing data before it enters Google.

3. Challenges and Solutions:

• Many advertisers face technical and organizational hurdles in setting up and transitioning to offline conversion tracking.
• Enhanced Conversions for Leads reduces these barriers by simplifying data integration.

4. Impact of Accurate Data on Automated Bidding:

• Providing accurate conversion data allows automated systems like Performance Max to make better optimization decisions.
• Without accurate conversion tracking, automated systems may optimize based on incomplete or misleading data.

Episode Transcript

Frederick Vallaeys: Hey, I’m Fred, CEO at Optmyzr. I’m about to have a conversation with Jon Diorio, who’s one of the creators of offline conversion import for Google ads. He’s going to talk about some of the reasons why advertisers don’t set up offline conversion import and why not having this extra data is It’s a huge mistake, especially in this day and age of automated PPC.

So let’s get rolling with the conversation. All right. And here’s my guest, Jon Di Iorio. Welcome to the studio. So yeah,

Jon Diorio: I mean, congratulations. This is a pretty impressive

Frederick Vallaeys: space. That’s a nice space. Right.

Jon Diorio: Am I the first?

Frederick Vallaeys: You are the

Jon Diorio: second

Frederick Vallaeys: in studio

Jon Diorio: guest. All right. I know. All right. I can deal with,

Frederick Vallaeys: But you’re the first guest to go on one with me in the studio.

Ooh, last one was Two on one. All right. So I feel a little bit more evenly matched now. Good. Good. Well, I’m happy to do it. So but yeah, you were at Google for a long time and what’s going on these days? What are you working on?

Jon Diorio: Well, that’s a good question. I punched out about two weeks ago. And it’s an exciting time talking to a few companies, taking a look at what’s going on in AI, and then I’m mostly out of Google.

So

Frederick Vallaeys: you left Google, you left AdWords, but you couldn’t leave AdWords behind yourself? You’re still doing AdWords?

Jon Diorio: I’m still working with a few advertisers on the strategy and implementation side of things, yeah. I

Frederick Vallaeys: mean, it’s That makes sense, right?

Jon Diorio: After over a decade, it’s kind of hard to go cold turkey. So yeah, but I’m, I’m, I’m looking beyond ad tech these days to a number of opportunities and just excited by what’s out there, especially the generative AI.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, I know. It’s a crazy time. And you’re obviously here in Silicon Valley as well. Right in the heart of it. Yeah. Used to be the self driving cars that would like annoy the hell out of us driving by our houses, like a hundred times a day. Where did they go? I know, right? Yeah. I just, I’d love to get your perspective on some of what’s happening around here.

But, but, but really, I mean, your focus for a long time at Google was Google ads. You, you briefly did a stint in analytics as

Jon Diorio: well. Yeah. So I’ve been on Google ads for like a decade and a half. And then I also ran some marketing over on Google analytics and launched their premium service back in like.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay. So that, that sounds pretty good. But like how many people were at Google around the time that you left? Yeah, like two weeks ago. I mean, I

Jon Diorio: mean, well over 100, 000. I don’t know the actual number.

Frederick Vallaeys: So, so just to do the, the crackpot test here and to make sure that you actually know stuff.

Jon Diorio: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: Out of those hundred thousand people, like what did you actually do at Google?

Jon Diorio: So I was the product lead responsible for lead gen ad solutions. And so that meant two things. It meant. Doing lead generation ads through the standard Google ads platform, formerly AdWords. And then also running the local services ads, which is a verticalized like plumbers near me that you see at the top of the SERP as well.

And I’ve officially been doing that for the last three years, but I think the reason I got tapped to do it is because of all the work I’d done previously on conversion import. I think that put me closer to lead gen advertisers and kind of more advanced measurement advertisers in general than, than most other people.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay. So let’s talk a little bit more about conversion import. Yeah. Not exactly a new feature, right? So like, give us a little bit of the history of why that was built and then what it, what it is.

Jon Diorio: Yeah. So we were a few years ahead of the curve on whole conversion import things. So you know, the, the, the standard practice was for the longest time, the JavaScript based conversion tracking and what all these advertisers, especially Legion advertisers were doing, we’re putting the JavaScript tag on the, thank you for submitting your leads.

And that was giving the very coarse data on the number of raw leads they were getting. Then two things started happening. First of all, Legion advertisers started bidding each other up to the point where their CPCs were getting so high that I think the CFOs were coming back and saying, okay, hold on a minute.

Like I’ve been writing these blank checks, but But the numbers seem to be getting worse. And then separately on the retail kind of e commerce side, I think similarly, as the markets became saturated, I think their cost basis started going up and they started seeing the wisdom as well of beginning to report on the actual profitability of the ads and not just, you know, the, the sheer numbers and the cost per lead.

So in 2013, we went ahead and we launched basic conversion import. But then we fast followed because we found out that it required too much integration with the CRM solution. So back about two years ago, we released the new version called enhanced conversions for leads. And that’s a lot nicer because you don’t have to modify your CRM system.

All you do is you take data you already have in there, pass it back to AdWords and now we can record a lower funnel. So

Frederick Vallaeys: it’s basically like the double that sort of, Google ads or AdWords has always been that ultimate measurability, ultimate control. But in that advertisers keep demanding sort of that next level of profit margin.

Yeah. And in the beginning, it was literally like people would buy a click. It’d be like, Oh my God, that’s amazing. Like, I actually know how much I’m spending on a click. And then it became, yeah, no way. We need to know conversions. And now it’s the story of it’s not just a conversion. It’s like, how much money are you making on that?

Jon Diorio: Well, which of those conversions really matter? And then how much are you making? Cause especially in lead gen, as I think we’ll discuss in a minute, most of those leads never actually wind up being a sale and you can tell pretty early. So it’s, it’s a

Frederick Vallaeys: conversion in terms of somebody fill out a form, but nothing happens after it picks up the phone.

Yeah. Maybe the number doesn’t even ring. Yeah. And so why is that, why is that a problem? I mean, and I understand the fundamentals of the CFO comes to you, but but I feel like it’s more of a problem nowadays than it used to be, right?

Jon Diorio: Yeah, it’s funny. We’ve kind of come full circle. Do you remember in the early days we used to use that Jon Wanamaker quote that half my advertising budget is wasted, I just don’t know which half?

Frederick Vallaeys: Every time, you still talk

Jon Diorio: about it. Yeah, so, so PPC solved that, right? Because now I’m only paying for the clicks. Well, we’re right back to that argument because now what we’re finding is the clicks are driving leads, but half of those leads are going to be junk. I don’t know which half. Well, in fact, I do know which half, But I’m not telling Google.

So, so if you think about it, there, there are three big problems here. The first is conventional wisdom, at least in lead general say that 50 to 75 percent of leads will never be qualified, right? It’ll be a graduate student downloading your white paper. It’ll be a buyer that just isn’t the type of buyer that you want.

So right there, half of them are going to be worthless. At least on top of that, you still have some spam problems where people have found ways to make money for themselves by sending spammy leads. And then I think the biggest and the most long term is what’s happening with Performance Max and the rest of Google ads.

I’m trying not to say AdWords. It’s very hard. Which is that the more they automate the way the campaigns work, the fewer levers you have to optimize things. And in fact, Right. Pmax makes almost every decision based on

Frederick Vallaeys: what converts. And that’s the thing here, right? Like you still knew which leads didn’t lead to anything.

You kind of knew what was junk and that’s fine in the days of manually managing stuff, because you’re kind of like mentally doing the math and like, ah, I’m going to be a little bit less here, a little bit more there, because you’re in the back of your mind as the PPC manager, you know, what’s happening.

Jon Diorio: That’s your value add. And yeah, you can tweak your keywords. You can tweak your targeting, but literally, like, if you look at Pmax now. If you don’t give better conversion optimization data, what are you going to do, change the words in your ad copy? I mean, that feels like it’s the only lever that’s left,

Frederick Vallaeys: right?

I mean, that’s just so you can still attach audiences to the creative optimization, but at the end of the day, the machine is going to figure out. Yeah, hard to show those ads. And yeah so yeah, I mean, you’re basically flying blind,

Jon Diorio: right?

Frederick Vallaeys: And do you want it

Jon Diorio: making this decision based on raw leads, where it’s 50 to 75 percent are junk?

Or do you want it making a decision where you’ve thrown out those raw leads and you can now tell Google, this is the 25 that matters. And that that’s what to me is just what’s such a huge issue here.

Frederick Vallaeys: Right. If I need an example for us, so we, we had the conversion was somebody, Yeah. Signing up for a trial of Optmyzr.

And so then we put it on automated bidding or we put it on PMAX and all of a sudden you see this like spike in volume from India and sure they signed up for a trial, but they convert at a really low rate because the price point isn’t commensurate with what they typically want to pay. But here you go.

And PMAX thinks it’s like doing this amazing job of boosting your conversions.

Jon Diorio: And it’s not even just performance max. I mean, if you think of even just traditional. Search campaigns. There’s still an element of optimization, like creative rotation or creative optimization that’s based on conversions, right?

And, you know, RSA is going to be based on conversions. So even if you’re doing a traditional old school search campaign, They’re still making automated decisions that are based on the conversion data you’re giving them. And in most cases, we’re giving them data where 50 to 70 percent of the leads are junk instead of giving them the 25 that really matters.

Frederick Vallaeys: And that also piggybacks a little bit on the story of last click attribution being not a great thing to do because You’re basically assigning all the way to the last thing that happens and the initial things at the upper funnel stage didn’t matter. And so again, in automated systems, it says, well, okay, it didn’t matter if it didn’t have any

Jon Diorio: conversions,

Frederick Vallaeys: then let’s do

Jon Diorio: less

Frederick Vallaeys: of

Jon Diorio: that.

Right. That’s a really great point. And so if you’re not measuring deeper down the funnel, you might be missing the fact that YouTube or another channel is either radically really performing well or really performing bad.

Frederick Vallaeys: Exactly.

Jon Diorio: I mean, at the end of the day, Especially when it comes to lead gen, but, but I’d say for all advertisers, they live and die by the quality of their conversion values or their conversion data quality.

And when you’re sending Google signals, half of which are worthless, well, they’re going to make fairly worthless decisions.

Frederick Vallaeys: So, I mean, I think we’re preaching to the client. People who watch this, they want to get this, to understand. So why is it that so many advertisers don’t seem to be doing this?

Jon Diorio: Yeah, I think it’s I think there are three things and some are doing it, but they’re not doing it Right.

So I think the first thing is just general awareness you know, a lot of these advertisers, a lot of these agencies have been getting by forever operating at this level. Some of them simply don’t know enough for now. And it’s good enough. No one’s pushing me. Right? The client’s not pushing me. My boss or CFO isn’t pushing me because they don’t know what questions to ask me.

Frederick Vallaeys: They also think it’s good

Jon Diorio: enough. Right? And I also, by the way, I may have just heard. I mean, there’s been a lot of fun that’s been spread around. And, oh, smart, that’s ridiculous. Smart bidding works very well with that. I’ve seen it. So number one is just general awareness, right? Number two. I think there’s just an element of fear.

And I’m look, I’m not putting anyone down when I say this. I think conversion import. Is a pretty easy, straightforward thing, and I acknowledge I built it, so that probably sounds arrogant, but it’s not hard to do. We ran hackathons across the world, and we’ve seen advertisers complete this in 30 minutes, but it’s technical.

You need to understand, like, what SFTP is. Right. You need to be able to talk to your I. T. person about extracting a value from the C. R. M. system.

Frederick Vallaeys: And so assuming for a minute that okay, it’s not that hard and shorter technical terms, but your engineering team can figure it out if you send the instructions.

And by the way, the tool gives the instructions of exactly what to do. Yeah, but let’s talk about that in a minute. But like, there’s also a level of fear. I think of it. Okay, now I’ve got this thing running. How do I transition to it? How do I? Oh, well then it’s like basically flying a plane and changing it mid air.

Yes. And hoping that it stays up, right?

Jon Diorio: Yeah, and I think that’s manageable and, and, and, Yeah, no, I could go off forever. Let’s let’s tackle that in a while. Okay. So I think to round out the point on fear, you know, ad sales people and people who run ad campaigns are not I. T. people. And so there’s often a game of telephone that happens when they have to then go and find the I.

T. people. You know, even just an ad salesperson. You know, they don’t want to look stupid in front of their customer because they’re going to lose credibility. And so they actually have some incentive to play it safe and maybe not push that way. Then the third thing is errors. And this kind of gets to what you’re what you’re talking about.

And we can deep dive on this if you want. But error number one is, well, what is that down funnel conversion event that I’m going to select? And, and I’ve just heard crazy things like I’m only going to give you some of them because I don’t trust you. It’s like, well,

Frederick Vallaeys: don’t give me anything. Right, or you’re going to put in some fake values along the way.

Yeah. It’s also, I mean, back in the day this used to be called micro conversions and macro conversions. Yeah, yeah, I remember that. And, and the idea was, okay, submit as much data to Google as possible and then you can start to build your own mix of. Yep. Okay someone signing up for a newsletter is worth this much.

Yeah. But somebody buying something is worth that much. Yeah. Yep. Yep. So that was Avinash on the Google Analytics side, right? Exactly. Yeah. But now you’re saying, okay, well, What is the thing down funnel that you choose as your conversion, but you’re not really limited to one conversion, right? I mean, you can still have multiple conversion actions.

Yeah, the system so you can import if you have a CRM What would you do? Would you actually import? The final sale or do you download those intermediate stages?

Jon Diorio: So there you go You you got to start with one and there are a number of factors that it’s fairly nuanced But there are a number of factors you have to balance obviously Optimizing to the very bottom here.

Let’s say there’s three levels raw lead Right. Qualified lead that throws out the 60 percent that’s junk and then final sale, which is like the 20 percent that really convert going for that 20 percent is really exciting. And it seems like the logical thing to do, but there are a number of different factors.

If your conversion rate is 1%, you’re probably not going to have enough data points there, or if that conversion happens. That’s a really long period to be making guesses and waiting for the feedback.

Frederick Vallaeys: So let’s talk about those two things. Okay. So first of all, there’s not enough conversion data. Google generally, I mean, basically at this point to say it doesn’t matter how many conversions the system will learn something.

Back in the day, it used to be 30, then it became 15. Do you have guidance on like what reasonably makes sense, even though Google doesn’t?

Jon Diorio: I don’t. That’s a third rail. The best I’ll say is advertisers shouldn’t be overly aggressive about jumping in and immediately going to the bottom. Right. Because if, if that first step of the funnel gets rid of the 70 percent that’s worthless, I mean, you’ve just tripled the predictive value of that data.

It might not be perfect at the bottom of the funnel, but that’s huge. And it probably happens a lot closer to the click,

Frederick Vallaeys: which means the learning cycle is shorter. And so let’s talk about the other thing, the learning cycle and that seven week conversion. And that’s not even extreme, right? I mean, you see businesses where it’s a six month conversion cycle.

Education. It’s like 18 months. Exactly. And so now this actually exceeds the duration by which you can import data back. So what, what’s the answer to a story that I’ve heard? Listen, after two days, it really doesn’t matter that much because the system’s already figured something out. I don’t know if this is a third rail, but like, what would you recommend?

One,

Jon Diorio: I did work on bit automation, so I can’t say. Two, I think the smart team would kill me if I started. And I very much like the smart team, they’re good friends of mine. So I can’t give a hard number. It’s really when, when I talk with, with advertisers about this, it’s usually a good thing. 30 to 45 minute conversation where we weigh the pros and the cons and the relative value of each in order to make that that decision, you know, like like in any client engagement.

There’s a good amount of time up front in dealing with I. T. To make sure they get it. They understand it’s simple. It’s not scary. They don’t engineer it. Then the very next big conversation that happens is where are we going to go in the funnel? Why is it a bad idea to merge them all together in one conversion type?

Why is it a bad idea to only get partial data? And so there’s there’s really a lot there. But, you know, wait, the time lag with volume of data. And to answer the point you made earlier, you can still track a million things. But you tell the Smart Bidding Engine which ones to optimize for. Exactly. So you choose

Frederick Vallaeys: your primary action.

So you import as much data as you want. And then you say, okay, this is my primary action today. Yeah. But then tomorrow, so as you now start maybe moving down the funnel, right? So you find really good results at that qualified lead stage. And then maybe there’s a next level of a little bit more qualified.

Yeah, yeah. So you basically just swap out what your primary action is, and then ultimately what Google Ads will use.

Jon Diorio: Yeah, I mean, what I would say is if you can do it, and there’s not much incremental cost to doing it, import every level of whatever funnel you have. And then later on, you can decide what to bid for.

And, and look, if you made a mistake and you bid too low, you can bid a little higher. But that, that is a really huge part of it. And then the other pieces is the smart bidding model. So once you start importing at the lower levels, you can actually bring in actual conversion values at the bottom or estimated conversion values in the middle.

How you make those estimates is, is pretty important. And that can be a really bad pitfall. But the other thing is, is. As you get to the bottom and you add the values, you can now start using TROAS as your bid strategy. It is sexy. It’s exciting. I nerd out on the math. I love

Frederick Vallaeys: it.

Jon Diorio: Value based bidding. If you tell me not only that there’s a conversion, but how much I can, they can optimize for the really valuable ones, which is great.

But if you’ve been doing like standard TCPA bidding at the top of the funnel, all of a sudden, you’re going to change your conversion signal way down here. And you’re going to change your smart bidding model as well. It takes a lot of intestinal fortitude to do that.

Frederick Vallaeys: And I think that’s the fear, right? So I think what you’re getting through here is the technical components.

Yes, there’s some stuff that needs to be done, but it’s fairly well defined. Really where all the work is, is in that session where you need to figure out what is the conversion remeasured? What is the value you assign to it? Yeah. What’s the trend? Transition path, as we go from one conversion action to a more sophisticated one.

So when you’re at that stage of the imprecise conversion value, that could be the pitfall, right? And you’re not done at the bottom of the funnel yet. I’ve always sort of said, listen, you don’t need to be perfect, but just like help the machine point a little bit more in the direction of what you want.

How would you

Jon Diorio: go about this? I mean, what you want is you want a fair degree of granularity in number. If it’s an estimate, it’s an estimate. Like, like if you catch. A transaction that’s happening mid funnel. You don’t know what it’s going to be. But what I’ve seen learned way too late with some of the advertisers to do this is they wind up with estimates that have three values, one, five and 10.

Now, look, it’s fine to index. If you don’t want to use the actual dollar values, you can do 1 to 33 for all I care. But when there are only 3 discrete values, that doesn’t give the model much to work off of and sometimes I’ve seen cases where it’s just like 1 and 7. And so

Frederick Vallaeys: you’re basically saying it’s fine to have like a range, but every conversion should have a distinct value within that.

Exactly. Don’t just have a bucket or two. So how do you get there? So let’s talk about lead gen advertisers.

Jon Diorio: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: Are we talking about build a probability model of the ultimate conversion based on your own data set?

Jon Diorio: Well, the good news here is typically the CRM systems provide that already. So every salesforce automation package out of the box has a lead object and has an opportunity object.

And in the opportunity, and often in the lead, there’s an estimated conversion value, what the seller will do. I used to do this in a past life. I used to say, I think this has the potential to be a million dollar deal. And there’s a 40 percent chance that I’m going to close it expected value of 400, 000.

Right. So very often the CRM system may have the value that you need. Now, marketing teams might feel better. Everyone accuses the sales reps of sandbagging. So maybe you need to inflate it. But in my, in my experience, the most successful advertisers work pretty CRM teams and trust what they’ve produced.

What’s the penalty. We’re getting it wrong. Well, the magnitude doesn’t really matter. So long as the relative number you’re using for each kind of differs, but if you’re just giving it like one, five and 10, the models have less richness to work off of, and so no, no fault of the model’s own, they’re just not going to be able to guess as well.

Frederick Vallaeys: So again, what you’re saying, I think makes a lot of sense. It’s about relative values to each other. And then if the magnitude is off, that’s kind of the same as just. Your TROAS is off by a factor of 10. That’s the same as over reporting your value by a factor. If you find that that’s the issue, you dial your ROAS back to whatever you need it to be.

Yeah, you can handle it that way. Exactly, but at least the system now understands, okay, I had thousands of clicks. I have an opportunity of buying for you. This one seems relatively more desirable. Go on. Well, no, I think advertisers are going to be curious. Like what are the signals that Google would think about it?

And so if you’re thinking about, okay, you have a simple example, it’s a million dollar opportunity, 40 percent chance of closing, and maybe that 40 percent is based on your understanding of, oh, this came from the UK versus Germany. Right. So now we’re getting into. Geo bit adjustments in a way.

Jon Diorio: Well, this is the advertiser.

I mean, typically in the CRM system, it’s the sales rep or an algorithm that they have that’s making that determination. If marketing wants to override that and come up with their own, yeah. Then we get into things like country and

Frederick Vallaeys: mobile devices. Is there a risk that the sales team in the CRM valuation duplicates the effort that the bidding system, because I’m assuming that geo would be one of the factors that the bidding mechanism is going to make.

Okay. So is there a risk that if you say, Hey, this is more valuable because it’s from Germany and the bidding system is also like, well, you’ve seen that Germany tends to over index. So it’s an interesting, it’s an interesting point. I’m a little deep

Jon Diorio: there. It is deep. I don’t, I don’t know the firm answer on that, but at the end of the day, I still think the smart bidding model would be working off of the conversion data and not just, Oh, we happen to also know this as Germany, or I would think they would deeply discount the things that they could assert themselves like device type.

And, and geography.

Frederick Vallaeys: Because there’s the conversion value adjust. System, which basically is a layer where you can do device type, geography, or audience level adjustments of the conversion value. That seems like a stopgap to someone who’s not quite at the level of conversion import.

Jon Diorio: That’s exactly why it’s there.

And so if you can actually give us good estimates. I don’t think you should be using those things. And you’d have to imagine that our models would be laser focused on those conversion estimates, on those values versus any other signal they have. Great. So,

Frederick Vallaeys: okay. So you got those errors in terms of people picking the wrong conversion, picking the wrong value

Jon Diorio: and estimating poorly.

And then the last thing, which, which is something that you brought up is in the transition period. So, I believe the company’s made a lot of headway and good progress in terms of reducing, like, any learning wonkiness that happens between them. But there are still best practices that are available, and I don’t have them off the top of my head, where you do want to make a pretty measured decision.

Change in how you do these things. It might require you to kind of reset bidding for a week.

Frederick Vallaeys: When you say reset bidding for a week, so it is the idea, load up your conversion import, let that run for some time so that whatever learning system your baby has enough time to recalibrate. Exactly. Two weeks is sort of the number that people throw out.

Does that sound okay to you? It’s

Jon Diorio: a number that I’ve heard. I, again, the smart bidding guys will kill me. I don’t know what the actual numbers are. And of course, the actual numbers differ by the type of advertiser, the geography, the amount of data. So, so I don’t think there’s any way to. I mean, my bottom line has always been no less than seven days. Because then at the very least you can start understanding a day of week matters. I would, I would say you want one, even better, two weeks worth of data. Yep. And again, another

Frederick Vallaeys: one of the

Jon Diorio: funny periods like Prime Day or Yes, yeah, try, try and do it in a neutral period that doesn’t have a massive demand spike.

And then, you know, going back to the point I made earlier, you know, the model’s going to need to adjust. And the adjustment from the top of the funnel to something kind of a third of the way down the funnel is probably going to be less drastic and scary than something that’s all the way down the funnel.

And, and, you know, of a lot of the folks, right, the first two things we talked about was just getting the thing set up. But with this last one, even if you get it set up, you need the intestinal fortitude to weather some learning period. And so if, if constitutionally your organization is very risk averse, maybe you pick a shorter.

Learning period by going higher in the funnel and start making more incremental progress. And these are, this is where the conversations really kind of get meaty and it’s It’s where I earn my keep.

Frederick Vallaeys: I feel that makes sense. There’s actually one last thing I want to briefly touch on enhanced conversions for leads.

So you said there’s like this simpler system that’s two years old. Yeah. Talking about that a bit.

Jon Diorio: Yeah. So the original system, so, you know, the GCLID is the unique identifier that pass with every, the way the original system worked is that had to be passed into the CRM system. It had to travel with the lead and then the opportunity to the final sale.

And then it would get passed back to us. And what we were finding was is. Ads teams are not co located with CRM teams, and it proved to be a lot of work. So now what we’re doing is similar to what’s going on in a number of different places, where instead we’ll take a piece of information from the form, most notably like the user’s email address.

And we’ll grab that, we’ll pair it with the GCLID, we’ll hold it for you. So later on, if that customer converts, all you have to do is give us the email address. We unpack it. We find that same GCLID and we just pass it through the system. That’s basically the privacy safe way. It’s encoded before it goes into Google.

It’s hashed before it comes into Google with the GCLID. So there’s no way to unwind. I believe audiences works on the same premise and, and a number of different systems. So yeah, definitely above board.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay, yeah, so check out Enhanced Convergence for Leads. Yeah. Very easy system to use. Yeah. But yeah, so any good consultancies or agencies that you would recommend working on this with?

Jon Diorio: This is my regret. I don’t know why Gordon and I are not doing this because it, you know, it’s usually a very important many hour process. You know, if you think about it, if you just get rid of that 50 to 70 percent that are wasted on top, you’ve doubled your ROI. So I don’t understand why that’s a problem.

Yeah, so, so no, I don’t, at this point, I don’t know any consultancies that do that. Well,

Frederick Vallaeys: you seem to know a thing or two about it, so I mean, I don’t know if you’re willing to consult. If people wanted to get a hold of you, what’s a good way?

Jon Diorio: Yeah you know, I’m open to it for the right opportunity. I’m trying to spend more time with my kids this summer so we balance things.

But I think the best way to find me is just link to me on LinkedIn at Jon D’Oreo or Jondoreo. com forwards to my LinkedIn profile.

Frederick Vallaeys: And occasionally people might find the two of us at the archery range in Cooberty. So on the weekend, you know, Bowhunters International. That’s right. Excellent. Well, thank you, Fred.

I appreciate this. Thanks for sharing everything about conversion reports. My pleasure. All right. That’s it. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Jon from Google. If you enjoyed this video and you want to see more of these, please use the subscribe buttons at the bottom of the page and we’ll update you whenever we have new content.

Thanks for watching.