How Experienced Marketers Work Differently With PMax and AI Max

Episode Description

Optmyzr CEO Frederick Vallaeys and JXT Group Founder Menachem Ani recently discussed advanced Google Ads strategies for the age of automation and AI. They broke down when advertisers should use PMax versus Shopping, why lead quality matters more than lead volume, and how to guide automated bidding without giving up strategic control.

Frederick and Menachem explore practical frameworks for structuring e-commerce campaigns, using phrase match strategically, and deciding when to layer in automation, like AI Max or smart bidding. Menachem shares real agency lessons on offline conversion tracking, optimizing for qualified leads instead of cheap leads, and why many advertisers misinterpret Performance Max performance.

The conversation spanned from how how agencies canharness automation to leveraging PMax for bottom-funnel traffic. Here’s what they discussed:

• Why patience matters more than ever with algorithmic campaigns
• How to start campaigns manually before trusting automation completely
• When phrase match beats broad match for new campaigns
• Why lead quality trumps lead volume in every scenario
• How to set up offline conversion tracking that actually works
• The difference between Shopping campaigns and PMax (and when to use each)
• Why product structure matters more than audience signals in asset groups
• How to prevent PMax from just recycling your bottom-funnel traffic
• What data Google still isn’t showing you about PMax
• Why agencies must shift from dashboard metrics to business outcomes
• Common mistakes that make Performance Max look better than it actually performs
• How to structure e-commerce campaigns when you have enough conversion volume
• Why AI needs to slow down (and where it’s pushing too far)
• The future of agencies in an increasingly automated world

Episode Takeaways

Menachem Ani has been in PPC for over 20 years. He runs JXT Group, a digital marketing agency that manages campaigns for mid-size clients across both lead gen and e-commerce. That mix gives him a unique advantage: he learns lessons from each discipline and applies them to the other, testing strategies that most agencies never try because they’re siloed within a single vertical.

When Frederick asked about AI Max, Menachem responded that he had been testing it since beta, and he likes it, but it comes with its caveats. It helps expand search campaigns, but he recommends using it the same way you’d use PMax: strategically, not as a default.

That sets the tone for the entire conversation: automation is powerful, but only when you understand what it’s doing and how to guide it properly.

Throughout the episode, Menachem keeps returning to a core theme: modern Google Ads is far more algorithmic than it’s ever been. That means campaigns take longer to get started, require more patience, and demand better foundational work.

You can’t just throw up a search campaign and expect immediate results anymore. You need to show the algorithm what’s valuable for your business, and that takes time, data, and strategic thinking.

Why patience matters more than ever with algorithmic campaigns

The expectations clients bring to agencies have shifted dramatically. Everyone’s using AI search tools now, and AI tends to make things sound easier than they actually are. Clients come in expecting instant results, massive ROI from day one, and seamless scaling.

The reality is different.

“Today, the ad platforms are a lot more algorithmic than they’ve ever been, which just means that it takes longer to get started,” Menachem explained. “You used to be able to set up a Google search campaign and just capture high intent traffic and go. You can still do that with a very granular setup, but if you really want to build a strong foundation for growth using the AI tools and be able to scale past that, you really have to show the algorithm what’s valuable for your business.”

That process takes time. It’s not just about hitting a specific number of conversions or spending a specific amount. It’s about building a complete picture: impressions, click-throughs, cost per click, and eventually conversions that align with your KPIs.

Menachem’s advice is simple: tell clients to be patient. Watch the soft metrics first and make sure you’re spending your budget, getting the right traffic, and not wasting money on irrelevant clicks. As the campaign scales, leads or sales should start coming in, and that’s when you can evaluate performance against KPIs.

But jumping too early into max conversions or conversion value bidding often backfires.

“The system doesn’t know where to go. Sometimes it works well out of the gate, but a lot of times we find starting off in a more manual way, forcing data through the system, it’ll learn faster from that,” said Menachem.

How to start campaigns manually before trusting automation completely

Menachem’s approach to bid strategies depends heavily on campaign type and business model. For lead gen, he starts with manual CPC and phrase match. That forces high-quality traffic through the system and gives the algorithm clean data to learn from. For e-commerce, he’s less cautious because the system gets revenue signals immediately and can learn faster.

“For lead gen, I like to start out with manual CPC and phrase match, just let it get very good quality traffic through, measure some good conversions,” Menachem said. “With e-commerce, I’m a little less cautious just because the system will get revenue and it’ll know. So I’ll start out with a max conversion value or something like that. Just let it jump right to it, and it’ll learn a lot faster that way.”

This isn’t about giving automation the right foundation to succeed. If you start with broad match and max conversions on a brand-new account with no conversion history, the algorithm has no idea where to go. It might work. Or it might spend your entire budget on completely irrelevant traffic. And that’s not a risk worth taking.

Starting manually gives you control. You can see what’s working, build conversion history, and then layer on automation once the system understands what a good conversion looks like for your specific business.

When phrase match beats broad match for new campaigns

Frederick admitted he takes flak for advocating phrase match, but Menachem backed him up immediately. Phrase match serves a specific purpose: it gives the algorithm flexibility without letting it go completely wild.

“It does depend on the industry and the volume,” Menachem explained. “If it’s a low-budget campaign, definitely start with a phrase match because you want the best quality clicks. But as you scale it, it’ll restrict you. It’ll hold you back. And so you have to layer on a broad match, AI Max, Performance Max, all that stuff if you want to scale beyond a certain point.”

The nuance matters here. An exact match is too restrictive for new campaigns. You don’t have search term data yet, so you don’t know which exact terms will convert. Exact match makes sense later, once you’ve identified winners and losers and want to bid differently or use different ads for specific queries.

Broad match, on the other hand, can be too aggressive out of the gate, as Menachem elaborated, “Especially in industries where you have very nuanced keywords, for newer accounts as well, if the algorithm doesn’t really know what a good conversion is for you, the broad match with max conversions can really go very wide. Whereas if you start with a phrase match, it won’t go as wide. Let the system understand what’s a good conversion, and then add a broad match later.”

The phrase match sits in the middle. It gives Google the flexibility to show ads for related searches while keeping things reasonably on target. Once the algorithm understands your business, then you can open it up.

Why lead quality trumps lead volume in every scenario

For lead gen campaigns, the number that matters isn’t the total number of leads. It’s qualified leads, the ones your client can actually sell to.

“For any lead gen campaign, the number of leads is less important as the number of leads I can sell a service to,” Menachem said. “If you’re getting a ton of leads but your client is not able to close any deals, that’s really what we’re trying to stay away from with all of this.”

E-commerce is easier in this regard because revenue is automatically tracked. The algorithm knows when someone bought something and for how much. But with lead gen, a form submission doesn’t tell you anything about whether that person is actually interested, qualified, or likely to become a customer.

This is where offline conversion tracking becomes critical. Menachem recommends connecting the client’s CRM—Salesforce, HubSpot, Zoho, or whatever they use—and sending conversion actions back to Google Ads whenever there’s a qualified lead or a closed deal.

“The goal would really be to use that, especially in Performance Max for lead gen, to use only that as opposed to just tracking leads. Tell the system which ones are the good leads. Go after more instead of looking at your cost per lead; look at your cost per qualified lead. And that could make a big difference,” emphasized Menachem.

The catch is you need enough data. He estimates you need at least 30 qualified leads per month for the algorithm to optimize effectively. That means you probably need 100+ raw leads coming through monthly to get enough qualified conversions back into the system.

How to set up offline conversion tracking that actually works

For clients using Salesforce, HubSpot, or Zoho, there are direct integrations with Google Ads. For everyone else, Menachem’s team uses tools like make.com or Zapier to pipe data back and forth.

“It’s fairly easy to set up. You have to be a bit technical, but once you do it a couple of times, it’s easy,” Menachem said.

Many clients are gravitating toward Make purely based on price. It’s more competitive than Zapier, and the platform seems more advanced and AI-forward. But at the end of the day, you just need something to pull data back and forth so you don’t have to rely on manual uploads.

The real question isn’t which tool to use. It’s whether to do it at all. For smaller budgets, it’s not worth the time and effort unless you’re getting at least 30 qualified leads per month. Below that threshold, the algorithm doesn’t have enough signal to optimize effectively anyway.

But for larger budgets with meaningful lead volume, offline tracking is non-negotiable. It’s the difference between optimizing for cheap leads and optimizing for leads that actually turn into customers.

The difference between Shopping campaigns and Performance Max (and when to use each)

This is one of the most common questions Menachem gets: Should I use Shopping or PMax for my e-commerce business?

His answer starts with a fundamental rule: make sure each product is only in one campaign. If you have products in multiple campaigns, they compete with each other and reduce efficiency.

Beyond that, the decision depends on what you’re selling.

“If you’re selling something that’s highly commoditized, like digital cameras or appliances, you probably want to stick with shopping,” Menachem explained. “There’s a ton of search volume around those types of products. People are searching, they’re ready to buy. Those are the kinds of products that don’t really succeed with Meta ads. So they probably won’t do well with creative assets in Performance Max.”

For commoditized products with high search intent, either standard Shopping or a feed-only PMax campaign makes sense. The customer knows what they want, they’re comparing prices, and they’re ready to buy. There’s no need for the retargeting or display components that Performance Max adds.

But if you’re selling something visual, like fashion, apparel, or cheaper impulse-buy items, then PMax with creative assets often performs better.

“If you’re seeing success on paid social,” Menachem added, “then I tend to push more towards Performance Max, especially with creative assets.”

The other consideration is purchase journey length. For items that sell in a day or two, you don’t need the retargeting component as much. But for products with a 30-day consideration cycle, that retargeting piece keeps you top of mind while the customer deliberates.

Why product structure matters more than audience signals in asset groups

One of the mistakes Menachem sees constantly is that advertisers create multiple asset groups with the same products but different audience signals, thinking they’re targeting different audiences.

They’re not.

“An audience signal is not like real targeting. It’s just telling the system, ‘These are people who might buy from me. Use that as a suggestion.’ So you want to make sure that it’s really segmented around product themes or category themes as opposed to audiences or first-party data like that,” Menachem elaborated.

Fred pushed back with a hypothetical: what if you have a running gear company and your audience splits between trail runners, marathon runners, and casual weekend joggers? They might all buy the same products, but wouldn’t they resonate with different visuals and messaging?

Menachem’s answer: only create separate asset groups if you have different landing pages and completely different messaging. If it’s the same asset group duplicated with different audience signals, you’re wasting your time. PMax audience signals don’t work like Demand Gen targeting. They’re hints, and not hard rules.

This mirrors an old mistake from the keyword era: advertisers would put all three match types of the same keyword in an ad group, thinking it gave them more control. In reality, one broad match keyword would have covered all match types anyway. The segmentation was just theater.

The same thing is happening now with asset groups and audience signals. Unless the creative, messaging, and landing page are genuinely different, keep them in one asset group.

How to prevent PMax from just recycling your bottom-funnel traffic

This is the biggest criticism of PMax, and Menachem acknowledges it’s valid. If you’re not careful, PMax just recycles your brand traffic and retargeting, inflating its numbers without actually driving new business.

“It’s more simple from what it might need from someone to set it up, but it’s a lot more advanced in what it’s capable of and how it works,” Menachem said. “Besides running those shopping listings, it’ll do retargeting. It’ll do standard search and shopping. It’ll display videos. And so it can find customers in a lot of different ways. And if it’s not set up the right way, it’ll just kind of recycle your very bottom-funnel traffic.”

The key is understanding how everything is configured.

• Are you including brand terms or excluding them?
• Are you adding search themes?
• Are you putting in creative assets or just relying on your product data feed?
• Are you targeting new customers, or new customers and old customers?

“If you set it up one way, it might drive a ton of brand searches. If you set it up another way, it might drive a ton of generic search. If you’re running advertising on Meta with large budgets or any paid social, Performance Max will largely recycle that traffic, and you won’t see a meaningful lift in your overall metrics. But if you set it up in a different way, it can really push new traffic,” Menachem added.

What data Google still isn’t showing you about PMax

Google has added more reporting to PMax over the past year or two. You can now see channel performance breakdowns, whether spend is going to display or video, and whether traffic is coming from creative assets or the data feed.

But Menachem wants more. Specifically, he wants to see which audience is driving traffic.

“Is it new customers versus old customers? You can’t see as much as you’d like there. How much of it is coming from retargeting versus completely new traffic? Even if you connect your customer list and tell it to only go after new customers, it’s still going to be retargeting website visitors. And if you’re spending a ton of money on Meta, it’s largely going to be just retargeting Meta traffic,” remarked Menachem.

That’s the gap. You can see that Performance Max is performing well in-platform, but you can’t see how much of that performance is genuinely incremental versus recycled. For agencies trying to prove value and optimize efficiently, that blind spot is frustrating.

Why agencies must shift from dashboard metrics to business outcomes

Fred asked Menachem about the role of agencies in an increasingly automated world. Should agencies become business consultants? Or should they stick to managing campaigns?

Menachem answered, “I think that at the end of the day, if I’m spending somebody’s money, I want to make sure that it’s going to work for them. And so if there are things that need to get done, whether it’s setting up a better landing page or more deeper end-to-end tracking, we always try to jump in and get it done so that we can help them grow their business and grow our business alongside them.”

This means recognizing that the success of a campaign depends on factors outside the ads account. If the landing page is terrible, no amount of bidding optimization will fix it. If the client takes three days to call leads, conversion rates will be abysmal.

Agencies that only look at dashboard metrics, like impressions, clicks, cost per conversion, and miss the bigger picture. The real question is: are we generating net new revenue for the client? Are we helping them grow their business?

That requires deeper tracking, better alignment with the client’s sales process, and a willingness to step outside the traditional agency role when necessary.

Common mistakes that make PMax look better than it actually performs

Menachem pointed out patterns he sees when auditing accounts. The most common: a PMax campaign with all products lumped into one setup, missing basic configuration like search themes or first-party audiences.

The other red flag is campaigns set up to inflate revenue by assigning new customers a higher value. “If you set it to target, to bid higher for new customers, you can say that a new customer is worth $100 extra dollars. That inflates the reporting by $100. So there are things like that where it just looks better than it is,” Menachem explained.

Or Performance Max campaigns, where the entire budget goes to the client’s brand, so it’s not driving any new business, but just recycling existing demand and taking credit for it.

“A lot of times, we’ll revamp it 30 days, 60 days in, and all of a sudden you’re seeing a big lift in Shopify revenue as opposed to just in-platform. And that’s really nice to see,” added Menachem.

How to structure e-commerce campaigns when you have enough conversion volume

Fred asked the question everyone wants answered: how do you actually structure a Performance Max account when you have decent conversion volume?

Menachem suggested mirroring the website navigation as much as possible.

Menachem explained, “If the client has three top-level categories on the website, that’s a good starting point. Three campaigns with all those products underneath it. Typically, the reason to do that is so now you have a budget going to each of the categories that are important to the client.”

If you put everything into one campaign, PMax allocates spend to the best-performing areas. That might make the numbers look good, but it leaves other categories starved for budget. Segmenting by category lets you assign different budgets, different target ROAS, and different sales goals to each.

It also gives you diversity. If one product runs out of inventory or something goes wrong in one category, you have others to rely on.

Within each campaign, use asset groups for product themes or subcategories with different visuals, search themes, or audience signals. But again, only create separate asset groups when the messaging and landing pages are genuinely different.

As for listing groups, Menachem typically does segment them, but mostly for reporting.

“From a targeting and performance perspective, it’s not really needed for Performance Max. It’s more for us to watch how everything’s performing,” Menachem added.

That granularity lets him identify underperforming products and either move them to a standard Shopping campaign with lower bids or exclude them completely.

Why AI needs to slow down (and where it’s pushing too far)

When talking about what frustrates him most about the industry, Menachem said, “AI’s got to slow down. It’s a little too fast in the ad platforms. Real businesses rely on this to provide food for their families, and it’s just AI, AI, AI. We still have to prove it out.”

Menachem isn’t anti-AI. He sees the value of smart bidding, algorithmic targeting, and automation. But there’s a difference between tools that work reliably, like smart bidding, and features being pushed into workflows before they’re ready.

“On some of the lead gen search campaigns, the targeting is way off base, especially for clients in healthcare. We’re looking for a very specific kind of traffic, and I’d love to use broad matches more, but if it brings a search that’s completely unrelated to what the client is trying to sell, I just can’t do anything with it,” Menachem remarked.

The same goes for AI-generated creativity. It works sometimes. It doesn’t work other times. But then it gets pushed into the workflow, and suddenly you’re forced to interact with it even when it’s slowing you down.

“I’m very forward-thinking when it comes to these things. I’m not stuck in the past. But I just want to make sure it doesn’t slow down the processes and progress that we have in place already,” explained Menachem.

That’s the balance: measured AI adoption. Use automation where it works reliably, but avoid rushing to apply it everywhere simply because it is the new thing. Establishing guardrails, understanding the AI’s operations, and ensuring it genuinely benefits your clients are all crucial considerations.

The future of agencies in an increasingly automated world

Menachem sees the shift coming, but he’s optimistic. Agencies have always had to evolve. This is just a bigger shift than what’s come before.

“The agency needs to provide more value in the overall strategic marketing and develop the strategy more end-to-end instead of just sending traffic and reporting on what you see in Google Ads,” Menachem said. “Make sure that you’re actually driving the business forward, generating net new revenue for the client, and really being more of a partner and less of a siloed agency.”

That means leaning into AI tools to make work more efficient, but using the time saved to do something even better. The tasks that automation handles free up capacity to focus on strategy, creative, business outcomes—the things that actually differentiate a great agency from a mediocre one.

“To me, change is exciting. It’s daunting, but it’s exciting, and we’ll find the best way forward,” Menachem said.

When it comes to hiring, Menachem looks for people with a specific attitude: “Let me just figure this out” instead of asking a lot of questions or waiting for instructions. That curiosity, that willingness to tinker and experiment, is more valuable now than ever.

The future belongs to people who embrace change, ask questions, and try to make things happen, and not people who wait to be told what to do.

Episode Transcript

Frederick Vallaeys: Hello, and welcome to another episode of PPC Town Hall. My name is Fred Vallaeys. I’m your host, and I’m also the CEO and co-founder at Optmyzr, a PPC management tool. For today’s episode, we have one of the most influential voices in PPC, someone who’s got a big opinion on Performance Max, and he has a big opinion because he’s been using it very extensively. He knows all the ins and outs.

And so today, we’re going to talk to Menachem Ani from JXT Group, and he’s going to share how he’s been using Performance Max as well as using other campaign types and basically getting to the roots of how to use all of these Google Ads systems to get the most out of it for your business and to make sure we’re not just shooting for vanity metrics or looking at inflated ROAS but actually getting results that make clients happy and make them keep coming back for more from agencies. So with that, let’s get rolling with this episode of PPC Town Hall.

Hey, Menachem, welcome back to the show. It’s great to have you on.

Menachem Ani: It’s great to be on. It’s always good to talk.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, last time we talked, I was in person for the Google Marketing Live, I believe.

Menachem Ani: Yeah, that’s always a fun time. Always exciting to hear new things and try them out.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. Well, hey, let’s jump right into that. So I know we’re going to talk a lot about Performance Max, but the new thing since last year is AI Max. Is that something you’ve had a chance to play with?

Menachem Ani: Yeah, we’ve been playing around with it since it’s been in beta. I kind of like it. It really does help you expand your search campaigns, but my recommendation is use it when you would use Performance Max because I think a lot of the same underpinnings, you know, taking the pieces of search and shopping and bringing it to your search campaigns where it makes sense, right?

And so to maybe give people a little bit more context, for those of the listeners that haven’t met you before, where do you get all your experience? What does JXT Group do?

Frederick Vallaeys: Sure.

Menachem Ani: We’re a digital marketing agency. We manage campaigns for mid-size clients. Typically, it’s a mix of lead gen and e-commerce. So we learn the best of each discipline and kind of apply it to each other. So a lot of times we’ll try things from e-commerce for lead gen and lead gen for e-commerce, try different strategies, and really figure out what works for our clients.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay, that’s great. And so one of the things I know you’ve been writing and talking about quite a bit is when clients come along, maybe start with a new agency, maybe start advertising for the first time, the expectations can be quite high, right? And I think part of that maybe comes from the fact that everybody’s doing AI searches now, and AI likes to stroke people’s egos and maybe make it sound a little bit easier than things really are in life.

And so they come in with huge expectations. But what’s the reality that you see when people start with a campaign, say, like Performance Max?

Menachem Ani: The reality that we’re seeing is that today the ad platforms are a lot more algorithmic than they’ve ever been, which just means that it takes longer to get started because you used to be able to set up a Google search campaign and just capture high-intent traffic and go. And you can still do that with a very granular setup, but if you really want to build a strong foundation for growth using the AI tools and be able to scale past that, you really got to show the algorithm what’s valuable for your business.

So it can take a bit of time to set up the right tracking, the right keywords, the right ad copy, get the conversions rolling, and then really build on it. So I think I just tell people patience more than anything.

Frederick Vallaeys: And let’s go a little bit deeper on that, right? So is that patience related to a specific amount of time? Is that related to a specific number of clicks, impressions, conversions? Where’s that sweet spot that you see?

Menachem Ani: It’s probably a mix of all the above. Like you’re starting out, you’re looking at the soft metrics in the account. You’re looking at your impressions, your click-throughs, your cost per click, all that stuff. You want to make sure that you’re spending your budget, you’re getting the right traffic.

And as it starts to scale up, obviously, you need to make sure leads come in, or sales come in, and you’re hitting your KPIs. But the first thing is traffic. A lot of times if you start a campaign, jump in too early to max conversions or conversion value, the system doesn’t know where to go. Sometimes it works well out of the gate, but a lot of times we find starting off in a more manual way, forcing data through the system, it’ll learn faster from that.

Frederick Vallaeys: Right. And you’re specifically referring there to the bid strategies that you would select.

Menachem Ani: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: So you’re basically saying would you go manual CPC, maximize conversions before switching to more of a ROAS or CPA-limited model?

Menachem Ani: Yeah. So I think depending on the campaign type, for lead gen, I like to start out with manual CPC and phrase match, just let it get very good quality traffic through, measure some good conversions. With e-commerce, I’m a little less cautious just because the system will get revenue and it’ll know. So I’ll start out with a max conversion value or something like that. Just let it jump right to it, and it’ll learn a lot faster that way.

Frederick Vallaeys: Hey, and I’m happy to hear someone say start with phrase match because I’m kind of a fan of phrase match too, and I take a lot of flak for that. But what’s your thought process around liking phrase matches?

Menachem Ani: So it does depend on the industry and the volume. If it’s a low-budget campaign, definitely start with a phrase match because you want the best quality clicks. But as you scale it, it’ll restrict you. It’ll hold you back. And so you have to layer on broad match, AI Max, Performance Max, all that stuff if you want to scale beyond a certain point, which is important for many businesses, right?

And so I think the nuance there is that exact match is obviously too specific for a new campaign. You can put in exact matches once you see the search terms data coming in, and you find your winners and losers, and you use exact as negatives or positives to maybe bid differently, maybe different ads for them. But a broad match, I suppose, can also be a little bit overly aggressive right in the beginning. So it’s basically telling Google, “Hey, go and do anything you want.”

Whereas phrase match is still kind of like that sweet middle spot which gives them a little flexibility but not too much.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah.

Menachem Ani: And especially in industries where you have very nuanced keywords, for newer accounts as well, if the algorithm doesn’t really know what a good conversion is for you, the broad match with max conversions can really go very wide. Whereas if you start with a phrase match, it won’t go as wide. Let the system understand what a good conversion is, and then add a broad match later. I find that that does better.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. Now you said good conversions. Explain a little bit what constitutes a good conversion and to what degree would you focus on quality versus quantity?

Menachem Ani: Sure. So for any lead gen campaign, the number of leads is less important as the number of leads I can sell a service to. So if you’re getting a ton of leads but your client is not able to close any deals, that’s really what we’re trying to stay away from with all of this. When it comes to e-commerce, again, because we’re tracking revenue, I’m less worried about all this stuff, and I’m much more willing to rely on the algorithm and the broad targeting to get where I want to go.

Frederick Vallaeys: Now, I think it was you, but we were at Google giving feedback to a bunch of the product managers at Google Marketing Live, and the point of understanding the business that we’re working with came up. And so we as marketers, we can only do so much, right? We can basically direct someone to your landing page in most cases, but what happens at that point is really up to the business.

So to what degree do you think businesses are doing a good job with the traffic that we send them? And what’s maybe the biggest mistake that you see them make that they could improve on?

Menachem Ani: So that’s something I think about a lot because we’ll launch two campaigns that are very similar for two different companies, and one will do a lot better in that regard. And we do see a huge variance in close rates just based on the intake process or how fast they’re calling leads. Like you know, we have one client, he’ll call leads within 30 seconds any time of day, and his close rate is a lot higher than anybody else because he’s aggressive and he runs after it.

Whereas, you know, it is definitely a big piece, and it plays a huge part in the success of the campaigns, but it is out of our control. I try to give guidance and advice to people to make sure they’re following a good path. But I think the biggest piece we could do as marketers is make sure that the leads we’re delivering are sellable, that they can turn into a paid customer for the client, right?

Frederick Vallaeys: And then what tips and tricks do you have as far as setting up the conversion data pipeline so that it feeds back to us? Because ultimately, we could be sending them leads and have a very poor understanding of what actually constitutes quality. And so we could even look at a lack of a close rate and then start assuming it is due to us having poorly targeted when in fact it is maybe the fact that they didn’t pick up the phone to call that lead for two or three days, and that’s why they didn’t close because they’d already bought from someone else.

So how do you make sure that the data quality is high?

Menachem Ani: So it definitely comes from both places. The first part is obviously the search term reports, making sure that you understand the client’s service, what they’re selling, and that your keywords really line up. But then, setting up offline tracking where it makes sense. I think for smaller budgets, it’s not really worth the time and effort because you need, I think, at least 30 over the course of a month.

Not sure if they changed that, but unless you’re getting 30 qualified leads piping back in, it’s not worth the setup. But in an ideal world with larger budgets, we’ll connect Salesforce, HubSpot, whatever the client’s CRM is, and send a conversion action whenever there’s a qualified lead or a converted lead. And the goal would really be to use that, especially in Performance Max for lead gen, to use only that as opposed to just tracking leads, but tell the system which ones are the good leads.

Go after more instead of looking at your cost per lead; look at your cost per qualified lead. And that could make a big difference. But you need enough data. You need probably at least 100 leads coming through on a monthly basis to get a decent number of qualified leads.

Frederick Vallaeys: And what systems do your typical clients use to pipe that back into you and then you into the Google Ads system?

Menachem Ani: So if they’re using Salesforce or HubSpot, there’s a direct integration. I think Zoho also has a direct integration. If they’re using something else, which a lot of our clients are, we’ll typically use something like make.com or Zapier to just send the data back and forth. It’s fairly easy to set up. You have to be a bit technical, but once you do it a couple of times, it’s easy.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. I’m curious. So Make, Zapier, n8n. Yeah. What’s sort of the difference that you’ve seen between them? Because I’m certainly looking at some of these newer tools like n8n.

Menachem Ani: Yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: Zapier’s always done a really good job for what we needed it for. But what would be a good use case to maybe go with something a little bit newer?

Menachem Ani: Yeah. I mean, I find a lot of our clients are gravitating towards Make just purely based on price. It seems their pricing is a lot more competitive than some of the others. And n8n, I’m playing around with. So I’m not as familiar with it, but it seems to be a lot more advanced, a lot more AI-forward. So we’ll see. But at the end of the day, you just need something to kind of pull that data back and forth so that you’re not relying on manual uploads.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And to what degree do you think agencies should step into business consulting? Because I know that’s been a bit of a debate as well. And kind of the framing is that, as more of the PPC tasks can be done automatically or through AI, what is the value that you as an agency bring?

And so some people have argued it is just becoming a business consultant. But then others have argued that no, the client hires the agency to do things in the ads account. They don’t hire you to be a business consultant. So where do you draw that line?

Menachem Ani: So I think for me, we’ve always been a bit more of the boutique approach, trying to help wherever we can, even if it’s outside the account, just to provide extra value. But I think that at the end of the day, if I’m spending somebody’s money, I want to make sure that it’s going to work for them. And so if there are things that need to get done, whether it’s setting up a better landing page or more deeper end-to-end tracking, we always try to jump in and get it done so that we can help them grow their business and grow our business alongside them.

Frederick Vallaeys: And now with the whole consumer shift towards doing generative AI searches and using ChatGPT, using Gemini and Google, have you seen that change the volume, first of all, that you get on more traditional campaign types? And how do you and your clients think about making sure you play on these new surfaces that are taking more and more volume?

Menachem Ani: It’s definitely something we’re thinking about a lot. I mean, the whole world is changing. In a year from now, it’s going to be even more vastly different than it is today. And so we’re just trying to stay ahead of everything. ChatGPT just announced that they’re going to be putting ads inside generative AI, and Google’s been talking about ads in AI mode for a while.

So it’s starting to get there, but it’s still very early stages. I think one of the biggest things I would tell people is take advantage of it as soon as the option is available to you because it’ll likely be, you’ll get that first mover’s advantage. Traffic will be much cheaper. But I haven’t really seen any meaningful declines in any of our client campaigns in terms of search volume.

I think Google is very smart about how they roll these things out. I don’t think it’s going to impact their revenue, their bottom line. They’ll figure out a way to make it work. And so we’re just paying close attention and pushing forward.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. Yeah. And if anyone’s interested in getting ads on OpenAI, please leave a comment or reach out to Optmyzr. We have access to the inventory. Okay. So yeah. And then speaking of AI, and obviously, there’s this huge shift that you’re alluding to where we don’t know what it’s going to look like in a year from now, talk to me about what is your perspective on the future, first of all, of agencies?

Menachem Ani: So it’s definitely shifting, but I think it’s always been shifting. It’s just that this is going to be a bigger shift than what we’ve seen in the past. I’ve been doing this for 20-plus years, and I’ve seen a lot of different iterations of the Google Ads platform, seen the rollout of Meta ads, TikTok ads, and a lot of the other ones.

I think that the agency just needs to provide more value in the overall strategic marketing and developing the strategy more end-to-end, like I mentioned, instead of just sending traffic and reporting on what you see in Google Ads, to make sure that you’re actually driving the business forward, generating net new revenue for the client, and really being more of a partner and less of a siloed agency.

And then obviously leaning into all these different AI tools to figure out how to make the work more efficient and provide more value for customers. It’s not even about like, yes, some tasks are being handled by automation, by AI, but maybe now that gives us more time to do something even better and drive more value than we did before. So I don’t know. To me, change is exciting. It’s daunting, but it’s exciting, and we’ll find the best way forward.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And as far as career advice, I don’t know if you’re hiring at the moment, but if you were to bring on new people onto the team, what kind of skills would you look for that are maybe different than what you traditionally looked for?

Menachem Ani: So I think I’ve always liked the attitude in someone where it’s like, “Let me just figure this out” instead of asking a lot of questions or “How do I do this?” or waiting for instruction. The type of person who just sees something and goes, “Huh, let me try to figure this out.” That’s probably going to be more valuable now than ever because there is so much more to figure out with AI. The curious person who asks a lot of questions and tinkers and just tries to get it done, really just makes it happen.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, for sure. And the pace of improvement or change is so rapid right now. I mean, I don’t know if you have a perspective on picking a horse in the AI race. Have you picked a horse, or are you kind of playing between Claude and OpenAI?

Menachem Ani: So I’m kind of playing, I’m kind of bouncing around a lot. I find myself literally going from Claude to OpenAI to Grok to Gemini. I think at the end of the day, Google has a lot on their side between baking AI mode into search and then obviously Google Workspace. They have paying subscribers who don’t need to pay extra for it.

I think there’s a lot that they can really push a lot faster, I guess, than somebody like OpenAI, who has to build the whole functioning business underneath it. So I kind of think Google will land ahead, but time will tell.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. No, I agree with what you’re saying there. And for us, it was a subscription to OpenAI for the team, but then when Gemini adds that to the existing workspace plans, it does cost a little bit extra. You have to upgrade, right? But it makes sense because you also then look at, “Oh, do we need a Zoom license, right, in addition? Or does that higher plan then have the advanced Google Meet capabilities?”

And so they certainly have an advantage there, where it just financially makes sense. Yeah. Start using that one. And so long as their tool is good enough, on par with all the others, and right now you might say in some ways it’s the best that’s out there, so then it’s a no-brainer to go that direction. Yeah. So that’s certainly an advantage.

And I think the other advantage for Google is the fact that they have so much data, right? They have all of my many, many years of Gmail, of Maps data. Where have I been? So if I ask a question to their assistant, yeah, it knows me better. It kind of knows what I’m likely going to respond to, and that’s helpful to me.

Menachem Ani: Yeah. Google does have a tremendous amount of data across many different areas. It’s video, it’s text, it’s email, it’s meetings, it’s ads. So I think that Gemini will land further ahead than people think, even though ChatGPT right now seems to be the big one that’s in the general consumer’s mind. The kids call it Chat. So yeah.

Frederick Vallaeys: Well, and I don’t know if you watched the Super Bowl, but what I found interesting between the ads for the AI companies was that Google’s Gemini ad wasn’t super explicit about it being AI. People often probably don’t really equate Google’s capabilities with AI. But it was a brilliant illustration of how it could be useful in everyday life.

And it was also not very chat-focused. It was image generation-focused and sort of ways that the technology will improve your life in a way. And I thought that was great because it did speak, I think, to the average person who doesn’t really care about Gemini versus Claude versus GPT. They just want to get stuff done. And it’s like, “Oh, here’s a cool way to do something that I couldn’t do before. Let me try it out,” and who cares what backend it runs on?

Menachem Ani: Yeah, I would agree with you there for sure.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. All right. So let’s go back to some of the hands-on PPC stuff. But I know that you’ve also talked about sort of the fundamentals and the timeless principles of advertising. I think that’s super relevant because as we see so much evolution in campaign types and how you set these things up, what are sort of those fundamentals that you think people really need to pay more attention to?

Menachem Ani: So with everything, keeping in mind those fundamentals is important. Google Ads is primarily based on capturing search intent. Somebody’s searching for something that you’re selling, put your ad, let’s go. I think all the recent iterations are Google trying to move beyond the intent because if there’s a limited amount of searches happening for your keyword, all these new algorithmic features can take you beyond it.

But I think the important piece I tell people starting out is just start with the basics. So if it’s e-commerce, you might want to start with a shopping campaign, pull in search volume, collect data, what’s working, what’s not working. And for lead gen, it’s just a basic search. Get traffic, get leads, get phone calls, close deals.

Once you have some data, then you start to layer on some of the more advanced things like Performance Max, Demand Gen, or AI Max, and try to go beyond it. But ultimately, you can’t sell something to somebody who’s not your customer or has no interest in buying it. Like you do have to remember the stage of the funnel that the campaigns sit and the purpose of each campaign type. So start with the basics, and then layer on additional as you’re looking to expand beyond it.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yes. And so I hear you advocating for some of the basic campaign types. And it’s interesting because you’re saying Performance Max is the more advanced campaign type, whereas I think Google would position it as the campaign type for everyone. You don’t really need to have done much advertising in the past. You don’t need to figure out things like keywords. Just tell us your landing page, your budget, and we’ll figure this thing out, right?

But obviously the audience listening here today is a bit more advanced. So how would you frame this?

Menachem Ani: So I think it’s important to remember how each of the campaigns works. Shopping is basically looking at your product titles, descriptions, finding keywords, and matching it to people’s search queries. So it’s going to be a little bit more towards the bottom of the funnel.

Performance Max, it’s more simple from what it might need from someone to set it up, but it’s a lot more advanced in what it’s capable of and how it works. Besides running those shopping listings, it’ll do retargeting. It’ll do standard search and shopping. It’ll display videos. And so it can find customers in a lot of different ways. And if it’s not set up the right way, it’ll just kind of recycle your very bottom-funnel traffic.

And if you really want it to drive new business, you have to think about everything else you’re doing and how you’re setting it up. Because if you set it up one way, it might drive a ton of brand search. If you set it up another way, it might drive a ton of generic search. If you’re running advertising on Meta with large budgets or any paid social, Performance Max will largely recycle that traffic, and you won’t see a meaningful lift in your overall metrics.

But if you set it up in a different way, it can really push new traffic. And I think those are some of the things I try to tell people to think about. How everything is configured. Are you including brand, excluding brand? Are you adding search themes? Are you creative, or are you just relying on your product data feed? Are you targeting new customers or new customers and old customers?

So there’s a lot of different things it can do. And so it’s simple, but it’s complicated, right?

Frederick Vallaeys: And so yeah, you mentioned a lot of factors there that you need to consider. If people want to learn more about that and get some of these specifics, where should they look? Have you blogged about that?

Menachem Ani: Yeah, I have one on our website. You can go to jxtgroup.com . We have a fairly comprehensive article on Performance Max and how it works. And there’s definitely a lot more than people think about when it comes to Performance Max.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And so one frustration with Performance Max, especially very early on, was that it was taking credit and inflating its ROAS from sources like remarketing and brand. Now Google has added a lot of measurement capabilities, and they’ve added targeting capabilities. Do you feel satisfied at this point, or how do you look at Performance Max and how it’s measuring itself?

Menachem Ani: So to me, I think the biggest piece of Performance Max and how it’s different from a regular campaign is that you can’t make changes directly. The changes that you’re making are basically pulling the algorithm in a different direction. And so they’ve uncovered a lot more data. You could see the channel performance breakdown. You can see breakdowns of whether your spend is going to display video, whether it’s coming from creative assets or from a data feed.

So there’s a lot you can see there. I’d love to see more from Google in relation to the traffic coming from which specific audience? Is it new customers versus old customers? You can’t see as much as you’d like there. But also, how much of it is coming from retargeting versus completely new traffic? Because even if you connect your customer list and tell it to only go after new customers, it’s still going to be retargeting website visitors.

And if you’re spending a ton of money on Meta, it’s largely going to be just retargeting to Meta traffic. So there, I wish there was a bit more data around that kind of stuff. But I’m definitely pleased with the amount of data they’ve unlocked for us over the last year or so.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. And hopefully more to come in terms of what they add to it. And it’s always funny, too, right? I mean, it had so few options in the beginning, and that made it somewhat easy. But then now there are so many options that, as you said, there are a lot of considerations and decisions to make, so it does become quite difficult in a way.

Now let’s talk specifically about e-commerce for a minute. Advertisers here have the option of running a feed-only Performance Max campaign, or they can have a traditional shopping campaign. When do you use which, and do you ever use a combination of both?

Menachem Ani: Sure. So I think the first rule of any e-commerce setup, whether it’s Shopping or Performance Max, is make sure that each product is only in one campaign. If you have it in more than one campaign, it kind of fights with each other, and it just reduces efficiency. But then, how do you know? Should you use standard Shopping, should you use Performance Max feed-only, should you use Performance Max with creative assets?

I think for me it starts with what type of product you’re selling. If you’re selling something that’s highly commoditized, like digital cameras or appliances, you probably want to stick with shopping. There’s a ton of search volume around those types of products. People are searching, they’re ready to buy. Those are the kinds of products that don’t really succeed with Meta ads. So they probably won’t do well with creative assets in Performance Max.

So, either just Shopping or a data feed-only Performance Max. But if you’re selling a product that’s very visual, maybe like fashion and apparel, or even cheaper items where you do have success on Meta, then I tend to push more towards Performance Max and likely with creative assets, especially if you’re seeing success on paid social. So that’s kind of the main consideration.

The other thing I would think about is also the length of your purchase journey. So for items that take a day or two to buy, you don’t really need the retargeting component as much. But if you’re selling a product that might have a 30-day consideration cycle from when somebody first looks at it until they buy it, you might want that retargeting piece of Performance Max to just stay on top of the consumer’s mind.

So I think those are the main things I’ll think about: what kind of product, what stage of the funnel the consumer is, and how long the purchase journey takes.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, makes sense. We’re now 2026. We’ve been talking about Performance Max for a long time. What is it that you would say people need to stop doing in 2026 related to Performance Max? And what is it they should really double down on?

Menachem Ani: So Performance Max specifically, I think the biggest thing is don’t just set it up, try it, and then be like, “Ah, it didn’t do anything. Forget it.” As I mentioned before, there are a lot of different ways you can set it up and try different things. Lead it in different directions. See what works, what doesn’t work, look where the traffic is coming from, where the traffic is going to, what landing pages.

And just at the end of the day, it’s like everything else. You have to test it and test different strategies within it and see what works.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yep. Always be testing. Here’s one of, from my, this is called the spicy questions. I don’t know how spicy these are, but do you think agencies are over-relying on Performance Max because, in a sense, it can be easier to manage?

I know you say it’s harder to manage, and I know you’re one of the people who does it right. But what bad agency behaviors have you noticed that kind of piss you off, because maybe they give agencies a bad name?

Menachem Ani: So I don’t like to talk bad about other people, but I’ll tell you that when you see a Performance Max that’s just like all products lumped into one setup with very basic configuration, missing a lot of the granularity that’s available to you in the sense of maybe missing search themes or first-party audiences, or it’s like, why?

Another one is when it’s set up to inflate the revenue by giving new customers a higher value. So if you set it to target, to bid higher for new customers, you can say like a new customer is worth $100 extra dollars. That inflates the reporting by $100. So there’s things like that where it just looks better than it is.

Or if you have a Performance Max where the whole budget is going towards the consumer’s, the client’s brand, and then it’s not really driving any new business for them. So it’s those kinds of things where you’re just using it to sort of pad the numbers. That’s frustrating. But a lot of times we’ll revamp it, 30 days, 60 days in, and all of a sudden you’re seeing a big lift in Shopify revenue as opposed to just in-platform. And that’s really nice to see.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah, that’s amazing. So okay, you said it kind of pisses you off when you see all the products being put into a single Performance Max campaign. And I know this is a big question, right? Because you also mentioned you need 30 conversions over a 30-day period for the system to really be able to do a good job.

Now, I’ve always said this is 30 conversions of a certain conversion type. And I think you can split it between campaigns, and the system can learn. Not everyone agrees with that. So if you disagree, tell me your opinion.

Menachem Ani: But I believe, sorry, we’re cutting out, but I believe you’re right on that. It’s 30 of a specific conversion type over a 30-day period. But I think, like everything else, it depends. If you only have 20 conversions and a really low budget, definitely keep all your products in one campaign. But as you grow and scale, it makes sense to segment out better-performing products, seasonal products, different categories with different goals.

Frederick Vallaeys: And so then break it down for us between additional campaigns, additional asset groups, additional listing groups. What does the actual structure look like? And then just, let’s have an imaginary client here, but what if you have that decent enough conversion volume? Say you have a couple of hundred products, you have a couple of hundred conversions per month. How would you structure that?

Menachem Ani: So I think the way to think about it is to try to mirror the website navigation as much as you can. Because if the client has three top-level categories on the website, that’s a good starting point. Three campaigns with all those products underneath it. Typically the reason to do that is so now you have a budget going to each of the categories that are important to the client.

Whereas if you put them all in one, the spend might be skewed just to one specific category. Or Performance Max ends up pushing a lot of the spend towards the best-performing areas. And so by segmenting that, you can give them different budgets, different target ROAS, different sales goals. And it’s good to have diversity because if one product goes wrong or runs out of inventory, at least you have something else to rely on.

The other thing also is a lot of times, even if you do have something like that set up where you have three campaigns, one for each top-level category, you might find that there’s a whole subset of products that are not getting touched. And so then we’ll block those out from those campaigns and put them in a new one. Obviously making sure you have enough budget to run each one successfully.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay. And then one level deeper from the campaign, where do you use asset groups? What do you use them for?

Menachem Ani: So asset groups are very good for basically product themes. So let’s say you have a separate campaign for each high-level category, but there’s different subcategories. There’s different visuals that you might want to put with each one. There’s different search themes, different audience signals.

I think one thing I don’t like when people do is put the same products in multiple asset groups with different audience signals because that doesn’t really do anything. An audience signal is not like real targeting. It’s just telling the system, “These are people who might buy from me. Use that as a suggestion.” And so you want to make sure that it’s really segmented around product themes or category themes as opposed to audiences or first-party data like that.

Frederick Vallaeys: So that’s interesting. So say that you have a running gear company, and their audience splits between trail runners, marathon runners, and casual weekend joggers. They might all buy the same shoe, the same shirts, shorts, et cetera. Your advice then is not to have different asset groups even though there’s, I mean, I could clearly imagine they would resonate with different visuals in the ads and different core messaging in the ads.

Menachem Ani: So if you have different landing pages and completely different messaging, yes. But I’ve seen so many accounts where it’s basically the same asset group duplicated with different audience signals, in effect trying to imagine it was a Demand Gen campaign where you have different audiences with the same ads. That would actually work because it’s targeting your audience.

But in Performance Max, the asset group audience signals aren’t really targeted. So it’s only worth making them separate asset groups when the messaging is different and when the landing page is different.

Frederick Vallaeys: Interesting. So that kind of hearkens back to the days when people would put all three match types of a keyword in the same ad group, and they would claim that it was because they got more traffic that way. When in fact, the one broad match would have covered all match types equally, and you could have used the segment to get your reports to understand what was working and what wasn’t.

So you’re saying a lot of advertisers now kind of make that same mistake with audiences in asset groups when it’s not really necessary unless you have different landing pages, right?

Menachem Ani: Landing pages and creativity.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. Okay. Okay. And then do you go one level below that in terms of grouping your products in those asset groups?

Menachem Ani: So I typically do just because I want to see how everything’s performing. But from a targeting and performance perspective, it’s not really needed for Performance Max. It’s more for us to watch how everything’s performing. And a lot of times, we’ll go through the more granular listing groups and exclude maybe a specific product or a subcategory that’s just not performing well, and either drop it into maybe a standard Shopping campaign with much lower bids or just exclude it completely.

Frederick Vallaeys: Great. Okay, that’s awesome, specific advice. People hopefully love this. So thank you, Menachem, for that. Now let’s talk about what is your biggest frustration. I’m a big vibe coder. I love using technology to solve problems. And what is one thing that frustrates you in the industry right now? I don’t know if I can help with it, but what should somebody go out there and fix?

Menachem Ani: What should somebody go out there and fix? That’s a good one. I think AI’s got to slow down. It’s a little too fast in the ad platforms. Real businesses rely on this to provide food for their families, and it’s just AI, AI, AI. We still got to prove it out. It’s definitely very valuable, and I see the value of AI and smart bidding, targeting, and performance. But I almost feel like we need to slow down and take a deep breath until we figure it out.

Frederick Vallaeys: And where does it freak you out? Because smart bidding has been around for a long time and generally gets really high marks.

Menachem Ani: Right.

Frederick Vallaeys: It’s learned a lot along the way, and it can fail if you don’t have enough data like you talked about. But by and large, smart bidding, I think, can be trusted quite well. Yeah. So when you say slow down, is this about creative generation? Is it about broad matches always becoming even more and more aggressive? Or where is your main frustration?

Menachem Ani: So smart bidding, I agree with you. It’s definitely a very well-performing product. We use it pretty much everywhere except for very few scenarios like brand search or low-volume lead gen. So I agree with you on that one. I think where it pushes too far is on some of the lead-gen search campaigns. The targeting is way off base, especially since we have a lot of clients in healthcare, and we’re looking for a very specific kind of traffic.

And I’d love to use broad matches more, but if it brings a search that’s completely unrelated to what the client is trying to sell, I just can’t do anything with it. And so it pushes a little bit too far in certain things like that. Also in the AI for creativity, it works, it doesn’t work. The Ads Advisor, it works sometimes, it doesn’t work sometimes. But then a lot of times it gets pushed into the workflow, and it’s like I just want to build a campaign.

But at the same time, I should say I am very forward-thinking when it comes to these things. I’m not stuck in the past. But I just want to make sure it doesn’t slow down the processes and progress that we have in place already.

Frederick Vallaeys: So a measured level of AI is really what you’re advocating for, and that makes a lot of sense. Ultimately, I think we all want the guardrails, and we want to understand why the AI is making decisions and what it’s doing for us and make sure it’s doing the best for our clients.

Menachem Ani: 100% with you on that.

Frederick Vallaeys: Well, good. Final question. How was the Tesla tequila that I see the bottle behind you?

Menachem Ani: I bought the empty bottle just for display purposes.

Frederick Vallaeys: I have an empty bottle too. I bought the empty bottle from eBay because I couldn’t get a full bottle. I was too late to get that one.

Menachem Ani: I’ve been told I have too much Google stuff, so I was just trying to add variety.

Frederick Vallaeys: Yeah. Well, very good. Hey, Menachem, thank you for joining us today. If people do want to get a hold of you, where do you hang out online, and what can you help them with?

Menachem Ani: Sure. Sure. First of all, it’s been a pleasure talking with you as always. If anybody wants to reach out, I’m on Twitter, I’m on LinkedIn, or you can visit our website, jxtgroup.com . Happy to provide a free audit if anybody needs help with their Google Ads, and we’re here to help.

Frederick Vallaeys: Okay, that’s a generous offer. All right, everyone. Thank you for watching today’s episode. If you’ve enjoyed it, then please do give it a like. Put in some comments if you have questions for myself or Menachem. And with that, we’ll wrap it up here, and we’ll see you for the next PPC Town Hall.